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I just want to see the QB throw on time and in rhythm. The splash plays when the play breaks down aren't sustainable.

Brady, Manning, Brees, etc weren't splash QB's. They always got the offense in the right play, threw it to the right guy on time and accurate. That's winning QB play that's sustainable.

FWIW, Tyson Baegent looked great Saturday. Threw on time and accurate. 7/8 with 2 Td's. He's never gonna play under Caleb gets hurt but I greatly look forward to seeing how his nfl career plays out over the next 15 years.
 
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colin2229 said:
I just want to see the QB throw on time and in rhythm. The splash plays when the play breaks down aren't sustainable.

Brady, Manning, Brees, etc weren't splash QB's. They always got the offense in the right play, threw it to the right guy on time and accurate. That's winning QB play that's sustainable.

FWIW, Tyson Baegent looked great Saturday. Threw on time and accurate. 7/8 with 2 Td's. He's never gonna play under Caleb gets hurt but I greatly look forward to seeing how his nfl career plays out over the next 15 years.
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Agree with all your points except for Bagent being in the league for a total of 17 years.
 
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colin2229 said:
I just want to see the QB throw on time and in rhythm. The splash plays when the play breaks down aren't sustainable.

Brady, Manning, Brees, etc weren't splash QB's. They always got the offense in the right play, threw it to the right guy on time and accurate. That's winning QB play that's sustainable.

FWIW, Tyson Baegent looked great Saturday. Threw on time and accurate. 7/8 with 2 Td's. He's never gonna play under Caleb gets hurt but I greatly look forward to seeing how his nfl career plays out over the next 15 years.
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Here is where Allen helps a TON, IMO. The guy just gets open and I think we will see many a slant route to Allen especially early on when teams are going to blitz like crazy on Bears.
 
4Afan said:
How the Bears have handled or picked QBs? There's a big difference. Name a QB who struggled with the Bears but then went on to be successful with another team, I'll wait.

You're claim is that the Bears can't develop QBs, but I say they just pick busts. Jury is still out on Fields, but Trubisky never started once he left the Bears, then there's guys like Orton, Grossman, and McNown. The best QB the Bears drafted in the last 40 years is Jim Harbaugh and that's just awful to admit. So you can call me a hater, but until there's proof the Bears drafted the right guy I'll hold off on being overly optimistic.
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Payton was a good QB. Didn't even need the reps.

32 Passing attemps, 8 Touchdowns.
 
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If you want to seek the better divisions vs worse divisions you might want to see what the combined records were. The Chiefs won the SB in February. Yet the AFC West as a division was 32-36. The AFC North had the best combined record at 43-25. The AFC as a whole was much stronger record-wise than the NFC. The 49ers went to the SB and had a division record of 35-33. Last year the NFC North went 35-33...same as the NFC West. As a matter of fact, the NFC North was tied for second best division records in the NFL. That doesn't sound "Average" to me.
 
EdgyTim said:
Episode 2 was more meh....
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Agree. As I previously said I'll be interested to see if they cover the pursuit of Judon in tomorrow's episode. I'll always watch the show, but it's hasn't been the best the last few seasons.
 
LTHSALUM76 said:
If you want to seek the better divisions vs worse divisions you might want to see what the combined records were. The Chiefs won the SB in February. Yet the AFC West as a division was 32-36. The AFC North had the best combined record at 43-25. The AFC as a whole was much stronger record-wise than the NFC. The 49ers went to the SB and had a division record of 35-33. Last year the NFC North went 35-33...same as the NFC West. As a matter of fact, the NFC North was tied for second best division records in the NFL. That doesn't sound "Average" to me.
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the Chargers finished 5-12 and last in the AFC West, but were 2-2 against the might NFC North. Like I said the North isn't terrible, but they're not comparable to the AFC North.
 
SiuCubFan8 said:
last year...
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Yes, that's all we have to go on. You want to compare this year, ok. The Bengals get a healthy Burrow back, the Steelers get an upgrade at QB over Pickett, no matter who starts, the Browns get Watson back to go with a top of the league defense, and the Ravens are the Ravens. How is this even a conversation? Last year, yes last year, the AFC North had all teams finish above .500, something that hasn't happened since 1935.

Stop looking at things through Bears colored glasses and be objective.
 
4Afan said:
Yes, that's all we have to go on. You want to compare this year, ok. The Bengals get a healthy Burrow back, the Steelers get an upgrade at QB over Pickett, no matter who starts, the Browns get Watson back to go with a top of the league defense, and the Ravens are the Ravens. How is this even a conversation? Last year, yes last year, the AFC North had all teams finish above .500, something that hasn't happened since 1935.

Stop looking at things through Bears colored glasses and be objective.
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I am not looking at things though any colored glasses but thanks. I said, "I think the North is going to be a sneaky tough division". Huge proclamation I made ehh?
It is the NFL, last year means squat except for KC's trophy. I really don't care about what div had what record when they all don't play the same schedule. It is not apples to apples. And I don't care if Pit beat GB on a random Sunday/Monday/Thursday/Saturday during the regular season. It doesn't prove anything other than Pit was better on that given day.
It's a conversation because it's the NFL. If you knew like you are acting, you would be on your island you would own.
 
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SiuCubFan8 said:
I am not looking at things though any colored glasses but thanks. I said "I think the North is going to be a sneaky tough division". Huge proclamation I made ehh?
It is the NFL last year means squat except for the record books.
It is a conversation because it is the NFL. If you knew like you are acting, you would be on your island you would own.
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What does sneaky tough mean? The Lions made the NFC title game so no one is sleeping on them this year. Because of that I think they regress a little this year, they should still win the division but won't be as good. I think the Bears and Packers switch places and the Bears make the playoffs, and the Vikings won't be very good. I don't see that as "sneaky tough", just an average division.
 
4Afan said:
What does sneaky tough mean? The Lions made the NFC title game so no one is sleeping on them this year. Because of that I think they regress a little this year, they should still win the division but won't be as good. I think the Bears and Packers switch places and the Bears make the playoffs, and the Vikings won't be very good. I don't see that as "sneaky tough", just an average division.
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I'm defining sneaky tough as they might not be "the best" or the sexiest but a damn solid division...again I was never the one that said they are the best.

Why do the Packers fall behind the Bears? Playoff team with a QB and had youngest roster in NFL last year. Can only use 2023 since final cuts are not made yet.

Why do the Lions regress and are not as good? Again, have a QB and one of the younger rosters last year.

Vikings I agree...
 
SiuCubFan8 said:
I'm defining sneaky tough as they might not be "the best" or the sexiest but a damn solid division...again I was never the one that said they are the best.

Why do the Packers fall behind the Bears? Playoff team with a QB and had youngest roster in NFL last year. Can only use 2023 since final cuts are not made yet.

Why do the Lions regress and are not as good? Again, have a QB and one of the younger rosters last year.

Vikings I agree...
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Just think the Lions snuck up on some teams last year and won't be as good this year, though still a deserving favorite to win the division. The Bears beat them once and should have been twice, but the coaches fooked that up. Love wouldn't be the first QB to take a step back after getting the big pay day.
 
4Afan said:
What does sneaky tough mean? The Lions made the NFC title game so no one is sleeping on them this year. Because of that I think they regress a little this year, they should still win the division but won't be as good. I think the Bears and Packers switch places and the Bears make the playoffs, and the Vikings won't be very good. I don't see that as "sneaky tough", just an average division.
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Wait you think the Bears switch places with the Packers? Maybe you’re not a hater! 😂
Honestly I don’t think the lions regress. I am not a believer especially with the QB.
 
corey90 said:
Wait you think the Bears switch places with the Packers? Maybe you’re not a hater! 😂
Honestly I don’t think the lions regress. I am not a believer especially with the QB.
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I've never been a hater, just realistic. The Bears have never drafted a franchise QB so excuse me for not being head over heals for Williams out of the gate.
 
4Afan said:
I've never been a hater, just realistic. The Bears have never drafted a franchise QB so excuse me for not being head over heels for Williams out of the gate.
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4Afan
I get it. I am hopeful he can be the QB I watched at USC. He has special talents that if he can get used to playing in the NFL he will do things that you won’t believe is possible. He will definitely make watching the Bears more exciting. I am for once hopeful that the Bears will become a team to take notice.
 
corey90 said:
4Afan
I get it. I am hopeful he can be the QB I watched at USC. He has special talents that if he can get used to playing in the NFL he will do things that you won’t believe is possible. He will definitely make watching the Bears more exciting. I am for once hopeful that the Bears will become a team to take notice.
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Remove Williams and insert Fields and you have the same comments that were made when he was drafted.

Also, go back to approximately page 72 of this thread where I dove into Williams in college and not being able to beat ranked teams and his stats against them.
 
"I think it's just a tragedy that we're forcing these rookies to play early, but the reality is the only reason why we are is because we've dumbed the game down, which has allowed them to play."

-Tom Brady

The GOAT chiming in on rookie QBs being thrown into the fire.
 
4Afan said:
the Chargers finished 5-12 and last in the AFC West, but were 2-2 against the might NFC North. Like I said the North isn't terrible, but they're not comparable to the AFC North.
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I am talking about overall records. And like it or not, the NFC North was tied for the second best record in the NFL, period. You have stated the obvious. Yeah, the AFC North was very much the best division in football. The record shows it. Like Bill Parcells once said, "you are what your record says you are."
 
4Afan said:
"I think it's just a tragedy that we're forcing these rookies to play early, but the reality is the only reason why we are is because we've dumbed the game down, which has allowed them to play."

-Tom Brady

The GOAT chiming in on rookie QBs being thrown into the fire.
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I have a hard time with this quote.

Tom won a SB as a rookie. So did Big Ben. Brock Purdy did great as a rookie. There are loads of examples.
 
4Afan said:
Remove Williams and insert Fields and you have the same comments that were made when he was drafted.

Also, go back to approximately page 72 of this thread where I dove into Williams in college and not being able to beat ranked teams and his stats against them.
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colin2229 said:
I have a hard time with this quote.

Tom won a SB as a rookie. So did Big Ben. Brock Purdy did great as a rookie. There are loads of examples.
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I’ve been looking at stats of some of the best quarterbacks to play. How many people are raving about Josh Allen at Wyoming or Ben Roethlisberger and Miami beating Toledo?

Clearly you are in a small select group that doesn’t think Williams has the skill set based on poor performance against Notre Dame or Washington.

I’m sure you were wowed by David Klingler and Andre Ware by the huge numbers they put up in key games.

Clearly he sucked so much that he won a Heisman Trophy. I have to seriously using your football acumen if you believe past performance is a true indicator of future results.

Glad your not the GM of the team I root for
 
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colin2229 said:
I have a hard time with this quote.

Tom won a SB as a rookie. So did Big Ben. Brock Purdy did great as a rookie. There are loads of examples.
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Tom was drafted in 2000 but didn't play until 2001, Ben was drafted in 2004 and won the Super Bowl in 2006, so neither were forced into it in their first year.
 
4Afan said:
Tom was drafted in 2000 but didn't play until 2001, Ben was drafted in 2004 and won the Super Bowl in 2006, so neither were forced into it in their first year.
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Ever heard of CJ Stroud? Heard he was pretty good last year. Russell Wilson, Baker Mayfield, Dak Prescott, Mac Jones, Justin Herbert Matt Ryan Carson Wentz - all pretty good players in their rookie years. But hey rookie quarterback is are not always good in their first year so their is that. Again glad you aren’t the GM
 
LakeCtyNewt said:
I’ve been looking at stats of some of the best quarterbacks to play. How many people are raving about Josh Allen at Wyoming or Ben Roethlisberger and Miami beating Toledo?

Clearly you are in a small select group that doesn’t think Williams has the skill set based on poor performance against Notre Dame or Washington.

I’m sure you were wowed by David Klingler and Andre Ware by the huge numbers they put up in key games.

Clearly he sucked so much that he won a Heisman Trophy. I have to seriously using your football acumen if you believe past performance is a true indicator of future results.

Glad your not the GM of the team I root for
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Ware also won a Heisman, how did that work out? If you're using the Heisman as a benchmark I urge you to look at how successful Heisman winners have fared in the NFL. Hint, it's not great.

Guys like Klingler and Ware were a product of a system, same with Tommy Chang. Williams played in a system that was catered to him. He has an insane amount of talent, but against pro style defenses he faltered.
 
LakeCtyNewt said:
Ever heard of CJ Stroud? Heard he was pretty good last year. Russell Wilson, Baker Mayfield, Dak Prescott, Mac Jones, Justin Herbert Matt Ryan Carson Wentz - all pretty good players in their rookie years. But hey rookie quarterback is are not always good in their first year so their is that. Again glad you aren’t the GM
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Among all of those QBs there's one Super Bowl win. Yes, rookie QBs can have had success but that's the exception not the rule. Also, Mac Jones, really?
 
Are you more excited about Caleb Williams OR all the offensive weapons he was given this year??
 
We could all go round and round on this debate.

Only thing we can all agree on is that it is extremely hard and not a proven science on how to run a professional sports organization.

So many variables have to align together.

* The GOAT (MJ) can’t build a winner running a NBA franchise.
*Elway Can’t find a serviceable quarterback.
 
colin2229 said:
We could all go round and round on this debate.

Only thing we can all agree on is that it is extremely hard and not a proven science on how to run a professional sports organization.

So many variables have to align together.

* The GOAT (MJ) can’t build a winner running a NBA franchise.
*Elway Can’t find a serviceable quarterback.
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Agree but MJ sold the Hornets for $3 billion and profited over $2 billion so I'd say that's a win for him.
 
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4Afan said:
Among all of those QBs there's one Super Bowl win. Yes, rookie QBs can have had success but that's the exception not the rule. Also, Mac Jones, really?
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Mac Jones and the patriots made the playoffs that season. Much like CJ did. But if we solely base how a player has performed in college as an indicator for future results we are bad at our jobs as a GM
 
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Thoughts on Williams and most of the starters not playing Thursday against the Chiefs?

I think it's a mistake and that he needs as many game reps as he can get with the starters.
 
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4Afan said:
Thoughts on Williams and most of the starters not playing Thursday against the Chiefs?

I think it's a mistake and that he needs as many game reps as he can get with the starters.
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I like what I am seeing in Williams. I think he is starting to get his confidence in the NFL. I agree I think it would only benefit him to play more. That’s a coaching decision. I think they are protecting him from a meaningless game.
I believe the more reps the better but I don’t get paid the big bucks to make that decision.
 
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