Can't evaluate who will replace him until he's gone. Clouds the mind too much lol.
No Cutler...
- Thread starter Dr. Mirakle
- Start date
Looks like you can add Kevin White to the list of wasted draft picks. Heard he has another broken leg and will probably be out for the season.
That's just bad luck.
The more logical thing is to blame Jay Cutler.
Dr. you keep talking about the entire team and yes the Bears need a lot of help in all areas. The one thing you and other Cutler lovers fail to acknowledge is "What has Cutler done since playing for the Bears" that warrants such support?
He has done nothing, won nothing and certainly is not worth the money spent on him. You have to rebuild and start somewhere. I and others would like to start with the QB. Your excuse about the Bears not grooming/training a QB is crap. You have to try or what just give up? You have been defending Cutler for years look back at your posts. You finally said above it has not worked out. That's is as close to you saying you were wrong about him. The Bears need to cut him loose and get rid of the cancerous tone he represents on the team.
He is no winning leader never has been.
Corey:
This is what I am talking about. You have constantly blamed Cutler alone for the Bears failure. I have never seen a negative thing written by you about the defense. I have said several times that NO QB could win with the team the Bears have had for the past several years. So, rebuilding the team starting with QB means nothing if you don't rebuild the entire team. That is and always has been my point.
There is nothing for me to say I was wrong about anything. I would like you to point out where I said the Bears would win a championship with Cutler. I have never once written he is worth the money. Find the post I made where I said that and then we'll talk.
It's never been a matter of "defending" Cutler. If guys aren't blocking, they aren't blocking. If he isn't getting time to throw, he isn't. BUT I have NEVER made an excuse once when he has played badly. Show me where I have and we'll talk. What am I going to say if he turns the ball over three times? It's the defense's fault? But, if the defense sucks I am going to say it and you never do.
Now to the heart of the discussion. You and others have said the Bears need to get rid of Cutler. OK that's your opinion and I am fine with it. BUT, you and the others have been asked repeatedly WHO are you going to replace him with? I'll ask you again. Name me the guy you want to bring in. Name a guy in the draft you would like to see the Bears take next year. And don't be so silly as to say "anyone will do." because just anyone won't do.
Corey, the way your posts have read the whole time is that Cutler is the only problem and if we could just replace him things would get better. I don't agree with that. Things won't get better until several positions are shored up. That's reality. I just read an article yesterday that suggested the Bears were running plays last week designed to get Brian Hoyer out of the pocket and increase his options. The writer went on to ask why they weren't running these plays when Cutler was the QB. I personally don't think there is some kind of conspiracy as the writer was gently suggesting.
If the Bears had a good team on both sides of the ball surrounding Cutler and they were still losing you would have a point and I would agree. But that isn't true right now. They have had teams like that in the past with a lousy QB and I have been all over that QB.
Corey I have seen your posts too and guys like you are always going to blame the QB first when a team isn't winning. You will be doing the same thing when the next QB or the one after that comes in and the team isn't winning. I have dealt with guys like you for 40 years. You need to take your eyes off the ball sometimes when you watch a game.
Finally, I stand by my comment that the Bears have done a terrible job developing QBs ever since I first watched the team in the late 1960s. Name me one QB they have developed into a real good QB and again...we'll talk. No, that isn't an excuse for Cutler.
So look at my posts. I have repeatedly stated the Bears have tons of issues besides just the QB. You tend to ignore the fact that Cutler has not won anything with the Bears or the Broncos. I also stated the Bears should of drafted Jimmy Geriopalo when they had a pick and could of. Quit sticking up for the hack. Say what you will but you don't know me and saying you have dealt with guys like me for 40 years not only shows your age but also your ignorance. Stick to talking about football and refrain from your sideways personal attacks just because we disagree. Judging by your 40 year comment, someone of your age should no better.
Last edited:
Corey: I am not going to continue to go back and forth with you. The fact is I have been dealing with guys like you who only watch the ball when its snapped. I simply told you to not to watch only the ball. That isn't a personal attack. A personal attack would be if I said you're ignorant...like you did to me. But, like you said, you don't know me so it doesn't bother me. I can brush it off. I am speaking objectively...you took it personally and judging by what you have written over and over I can infer without hesitation that you pretty much watch only the ball. If your writings were different, my deductions would be different.
Really..and for the 1,000th time, I am not sticking up for Cutler. I simply mention the Bears have a lot of problems and it isn't just the QB like you tend to conclude. I have also said repeatedly that no QB could win with this team. That statement has gone unchallenged by you and everyone else posting here. So, my point is more correct than yours...but in the vast scheme of things who in hell cares?
By the way...40 years ago puts me at 15 at the time. My hunch is that we are close in age. Correct? I'd love to see the Bears winning games. Yes, a rebuild is necessary and I can't disagree with the idea of starting at QB. BUT, if that is the plan, the Bears had better get some help at the same time to protect that QB or it won't matter who the guy is.
Corey...take a deep breath and smile. We aren't arguing over a cure for cancer although this thread has gotten crazy from time to time. Actually, you should be in a good mood! The Cubs won last night and all is good on the northside. Hahaha! I have learned to brush stuff off on this board and stopped taking stuff personally.
Corey:
Sorry, I missed your point about Jimmy Garoppolo. It's easy to say, coulda, woulda, shoulda. Scouts and GMs don't have that luxury. If we want to go that route I could say the Bears should have drafted Joe Montana instead of letting him pass by twice and they should have drafted Tom Brady when he went around a ridiculous SIX times. Or how about Willie Gualt instead of Henry Ellard?
I was saying, look into the future and who do you see? THAT is the real challenge and the biggest challenge any scout or GM faces. The great ones are the ones who can look ahead a few years, especially on draft picks after the second round.
Sorry, I missed your point about Jimmy Garoppolo. It's easy to say, coulda, woulda, shoulda. Scouts and GMs don't have that luxury. If we want to go that route I could say the Bears should have drafted Joe Montana instead of letting him pass by twice and they should have drafted Tom Brady when he went around a ridiculous SIX times. Or how about Willie Gualt instead of Henry Ellard?
I was saying, look into the future and who do you see? THAT is the real challenge and the biggest challenge any scout or GM faces. The great ones are the ones who can look ahead a few years, especially on draft picks after the second round.
And 1 awful read on last play of game with the best player on the field wide open. Never looked at him once. The Colts D is real bad.
and that equals 1 win for Hoyer...time for the ticker tape parade.
Bears are now 6-12 without Cutler at QB..thank goodness Josh McCown went 4-2 as a starter......Like previously stated,Bears need tons of work...QB is just part of it.
Just heard a quote...Hoyer is a great "fantasy football qb"...Awesome!!!
Also let me add...hope they let Cutler go soon...like this week,so I don't have to listen or read about people bitching about him being the reason the Bears suck.....time to find a new scapegoat.
Hey doesn't this actually support both sides of the arguement that Hoyer is a better QB than the $127MM mess that is the franchise. As well as the team sucks and can't win because of the entire team situation?
Better??? Maybe...he was with Texans last year who made playoffs,so maybe his 15.9 qbr in that game makes him better,because he was at least there.
So once again,he might be better than Cutler,but qb is just part of the problem...way too many to start with...starting with ownership,but they are not going any where.
He right now has a better three game stretch stats wise than he or Cutler maybe ever has had, yet the offense still hasnt done much in the way of results. Now I dont think its necessarily right to use such a small sample size when each guy has 25-100 other games to sample, but unfortunately including those career samples doesnt help Hoyers case that much. Overall I'd still evaluate each QB the same now as at the start of the season. Which isnt to say Hoyer hasn't outplayed his career norms, but hasn't done anything that indicates to me that something significant has changed. He still has some real issues that merely taking care of the ball won't overcome.
That said Ive always liked Hoyer. He is pretty much exactly what you want as a backup QB. He can start, but you should expect below average offensive production.
That said Ive always liked Hoyer. He is pretty much exactly what you want as a backup QB. He can start, but you should expect below average offensive production.
Hoyer sucks. I have no idea why the Bears signed him. If it wasn't for him they probably would have won. The guy is a cancer. They need to draft a QB...anyone would be better than this! I have no idea what the Bears are paying him but whatever it is it's too much! The Bears will never win anything with this guy! He makes terrible decisions and has too many turnovers. It doesn't matter what else is going on we need to rebuild and we need to start with getting rid of Hoyer!!
Gee whiz this is intelligent. Maybe it's better to lose by 6 points than by 14. Last time I checked, losing by 1 point is the same as losing by 20. It's a loss either way.
Only problem with this sarcasm is the bolded portion is not accurate. It's the biggest difference between Cutler and Hoyer. Hoyer has not turned the ball over in his three starts, whereas Cutler has turned the ball over on a consistent basis in his time with the Bears.
And interceptions and turnovers *cough*fumbles*cough are a fair part of the valuation process, but still just part. And for their careers, the total stats, including team stats still bare an edge to Cutler, IMO.
Hoyer's interception will regress to the average (NFL average 2.9%, Hoyers career average 2.4%; though if you look at one of the best predictors of interception rate - completion percentage - even his career rate seems low. Though Cutler's is the opposite, and I'm willing to call him an outlier, so maybe Hoyer is an outlier too.) Anyways, once those numbers normalize... his production will not look as good. And don't believe the numbers wont.
Which is all to say, Kudos to Hoyers stretch (even though the team has little to show for it). You've maximized your skill set, and i tip my hat and appreciate having a competent backup.
And I still get Fox not guaranteeing anything. If you want to preach that everything is earned and every spot is a competion, you have to practice it too. Still, hopefully he looks at the total picture, and Jay gets a shot at the job back, as I do believe he's the better QB.
IMO, this season is pretty much over....as it relates to this year alone. It's all about long-term decisions and the improvement of young players. They appear to have hit on Jordan Howard. Cameron Meredith looks to have some potential (the fumble notwithstanding). I honestly don't care what Fox chooses to do this year with the QB position. Hoyer is good enough to be a "bridge" QB. They need to get a young QB with potential in the system via the next draft. Ideally, he would have some time to develop behind a veteran. If it's Cutler (at a much lower salary than what he's been paid) or Hoyer, it doesn't really matter to me. If I had to choose, my preference would be Hoyer, because I think he would be more comfortable in that role. I'd expect Cutler to act more like Sam Bradford did in Philly. The Eagles hit a home run in getting a 1st round pick for Bradford from the Vikings, and also the trade and selection of Wentz. Hopefully, some draftable QB's emerge. No one heard of Wentz at this time last year.
Last edited:
I was illustrating absurdity by being absurd. The Cutler haters aren't always accurate either. Just having some fun in an otherwise disastrous season.
Most teams success start with their QB. Whether it's winning the game or managing the game, the QB is the center piece. Everything is built around your QB, including the defense. The biggest issue is always QB expectation.
If were doing something like Philly did, whether by trading up or just already having a top 5 pick, yes I think moving on from Jay is the best bet, and Hoyer is like the poster boy for steady bridge veteran QB. If you decide agaisnt this years top prospects and are developing a guy with little expectation of playing early, I'd keep Jay as I think hes the better QB, and he already has the perfect contact set up for a year to year decision anyways.
This thread is like Herpes - It may go away for awhile and be in it's dormant stage - but it never totally goes away and it always comes back!!
Is the cure the bears going 1-15 and drafting a QB with the first pick? OR did I just open a can of worms to supercharge this thread?
Is the cure the bears going 1-15 and drafting a QB with the first pick? OR did I just open a can of worms to supercharge this thread?
Hahaha! I would think that if you believe this thread is like herpes, it's better to stay away instead of getting involved and running the risk of infection...correct? Hahaha
Yes so True - but for some reason... I can't stay away
probably for the same reason everyone slows down to look at the fender bender on the highway at rush hour!
The Bears are that car crash!!
The thread is like herpes and Cutler he goes away for awhile but then some how comes back. Except he usually looks like he pooped himself but he still shows up.
Really though I love Cutler he is great he throws so many touchdowns. He is the best QB the Bears ever had! He wins more games and never turns the ball over. I really don't get all these haters.
Haters got to hate! I hope the Bears keep Cutler they can build the team around him. He is great, how dare those Bear fans question his talent and toughness.
Go Bears
My goodness...this team is horrible. If you can't score more than 16 points against Jacksonville, you deserve to lose. One of the worst things is that this organization is ruining the good reputation John Fox had when he came here. By far the worst ownership in Chicago and that's saying something with Reinsdorf in town.
John Fox is a pretty conservative coach. This is what average talent and conservative coaching gets you. Love our defensive coaching staff though.
Hey Corey,
Didn't Hoyer just have his 4th 300+ yd game without an interception while completing 60%+ of his passes? Remember I said blow this team up before they made that silly offer and many told me I was stupid. It's easy for me to think outside the box on this one because I'm not a Bears fan. Welcome to another 5 years of rebuilding, you could have started this project 3 years ago and at minimum $35million cheaper!
Didn't Hoyer just have his 4th 300+ yd game without an interception while completing 60%+ of his passes? Remember I said blow this team up before they made that silly offer and many told me I was stupid. It's easy for me to think outside the box on this one because I'm not a Bears fan. Welcome to another 5 years of rebuilding, you could have started this project 3 years ago and at minimum $35million cheaper!
Jwar
Look at my post 5 years ago and they again when they resigned him. I basically said they would never we anything with Cutler. Well here we are in the same old rebuilding mode. Excuses and constant Cutler lovers who want to blame everyone else but Cutler. He's a cancer and we truly won't officially start the rebuild until the drop the guy. Yes Dr the Bears need a lot of help everywhere and the owners suck I agree but we can't move forward with the cancer still there.
Jwar: Like Corey, I have asked you to give me the name of a QB who you think the Bears should sign or draft next year. It's easy to say "I said this" or "I said that five years ago." Let's look ahead. Who do you think they should get?
Jwar: I don't care what a guy's numbers between the 20s are. Two weeks in a row, when the game was on the line Hoyer didn't come through. The Bears are averaging 18 points a game since he went in to start. But, I will be different than you and Corey. I won't blame Hoyer alone. The guy is a journeyman backup.
You know as well as I that if Cutler played exactly the same as Hoyer over this four week period with the same results you and Corey would be all over him because of your blind hatred of the guy.
Corey: You say that I blame everyone else but Cutler for the Bears situation. You go back and show me one single post where I said that. I have never once said it was everyone else's fault and not Cutler's. I have said it isn't Cutler's fault alone and somehow you twist that to mean I am blaming the entire team and leaving Cutler out of the blame. You, on the other hand, have, on several occasions, blamed Cutler alone and the evidence is out there again and again.
One thing is for sure. I said no QB could win with this team a few years ago too. Neither of you two can refute that. And you continue to plead your case saying if the Bears could just get rid of Cutler everything will change and things will get so much better. I will tell you that nothing will change whether they have Cutler or not until the Bears improve in several areas. Cutler isn't even in uniform and the team is 1-3 and I will guarantee you 100% before the end of October 31th they will be 1-5 with Hoyer if he plays the next two games. They are a bad team no matter who the QB is.
Jwar: I don't care what a guy's numbers between the 20s are. Two weeks in a row, when the game was on the line Hoyer didn't come through. The Bears are averaging 18 points a game since he went in to start. But, I will be different than you and Corey. I won't blame Hoyer alone. The guy is a journeyman backup.
You know as well as I that if Cutler played exactly the same as Hoyer over this four week period with the same results you and Corey would be all over him because of your blind hatred of the guy.
Corey: You say that I blame everyone else but Cutler for the Bears situation. You go back and show me one single post where I said that. I have never once said it was everyone else's fault and not Cutler's. I have said it isn't Cutler's fault alone and somehow you twist that to mean I am blaming the entire team and leaving Cutler out of the blame. You, on the other hand, have, on several occasions, blamed Cutler alone and the evidence is out there again and again.
One thing is for sure. I said no QB could win with this team a few years ago too. Neither of you two can refute that. And you continue to plead your case saying if the Bears could just get rid of Cutler everything will change and things will get so much better. I will tell you that nothing will change whether they have Cutler or not until the Bears improve in several areas. Cutler isn't even in uniform and the team is 1-3 and I will guarantee you 100% before the end of October 31th they will be 1-5 with Hoyer if he plays the next two games. They are a bad team no matter who the QB is.
The idea that Cutler has held back a rebuild is a hilarious idea to me. Jay Cutler, the cancerous locker room presence is a huge myth some people can't let go of. Maybe getting too many hot takes from SAS and Skip Bayless.
A lot of times there aren't obvious answers/ solutions to the current problem. I will say that it's impossible to move forward if you continue to be committed to the marriage. At some point you have to decide if a QB to take you to the championship or not. If the answer is no, move on. True, going into something unproven doesn't sound like the smartest idea yet some of the better QB's in the league come from being an unknown or should I say not so obvious draft choice. I think Peyton Manning and Aaron Rodgers are the only two QB's who lived up to the hype however there are countless examples of individuals who performed without the initial hype.
Similar threads
