Private Schools 7 - Public Schools 1. That’s a wrap!

[crusader_of_90]

 

[HRCJR]

I'm just a simple accountant, but I think second string goes to at least 44. So you'd even have 9 3rd stringers

(but no the original idea is very weird and bad idea).

I just peaked on Naz's max prep page out of curiosity. It's pretty messy and obviously self reported, but it seems like a normal year might be mid 60s, maybe up to low 70s in good years? But yea, don't see much benefit from cutting kid 54-70 in terms of balance. Those kids are at that school because that's where they/thier parents want an education. They aren't being held away from their local public school that needs help balancing the sports talent scales.

I *think* CCL does use football participant numbers in their own division classification though. By all means, IHSA should ask them and find out more about that concept and how it's applied.

He said special teams cannot use players from offense or defense. That is 33. Plus a punter and a kicker and a holder.

 

[Dave Brody]

He said special teams cannot use players from offense or defense. That is 33. Plus a punter and a kicker and a holder.

Don’t forget about the long snapper. If there are injuries, I guess they’ll just have to play 10 or 9 against 11. Oh well.

 

[crusader_of_90]

This rule is gay.

 

[Cyclone630]

I'm just a simple accountant, but I think second string goes to at least 44. So you'd even have 9 3rd stringers

(but no the original idea is very weird and bad idea).

I just peaked on Naz's max prep page out of curiosity. It's pretty messy and obviously self reported, but it seems like a normal year might be mid 60s, maybe up to low 70s in good years? But yea, don't see much benefit from cutting kid 54-70 in terms of balance. Those kids are at that school because that's where they/thier parents want an education. They aren't being held away from their local public school that needs help balancing the sports talent scales.

I *think* CCL does use football participant numbers in their own division classification though. By all means, IHSA should ask them and find out more about that concept and how it's applied.

Naz had 71 players rostered on Varsity, and a total of 131 football players.

Those kids are at that school because that's where they/thier parents want an education. They aren't being held away from their local public school that needs help balancing the sports talent scales.

Does that hold true for the Naz players that for some reason are the only family member in private school while the rest of their siblings either went or are going to public school?

 

[Snetsrak61]

He said special teams cannot use players from offense or defense. That is 33. Plus a punter and a kicker and a holder.

Ha, I admittedly missed that part. Has OP ever watched a football game before?

 

[Snetsrak61]

Does that hold true for the Naz players that for some reason are the only family member in private school while the rest of their siblings either went or are going to public school?

Sure does.

 

[daveje]

This rule is gay.

Why would you say that? Of all the ways you could object, why this?

 

[33corndog33]

So easily predicted when you're over the target. Obviously the current multiplier is working 🤣. If its a level playing field everyone wants then this is spot on. Limiting players to one side of the ball will make some players think twice about where they want to go. Face it the youth programs that the private schools are hand picking from are selling the scholarship route to the top tier players. If roster limits are known ahead of time, then some of those players will take their talents elsewhere. This is when OP rosters start to balance out.

 

[Snetsrak61]

So easily predicted when you're over the target. Obviously the current multiplier is working 🤣. If its a level playing field everyone wants then this is spot on. Limiting players to one side of the ball will make some players think twice about where they want to go. Face it the youth programs that the private schools are hand picking from are selling the scholarship route to the top teir players. If roster limits are known ahead of time, then some of those players will take their talents elsewhere. This is when OP rosters start to balance out.

It's incredibly limiting for athletes of all kinds.

And if anything I don't know why it wouldn't have the opposite effect that you think. A lot of good teams, especially midsized teams still will star top players both ways, even if for partial snaps. So haven't you just opened up opportunities for new starting roles on those teams? You're kidding yourself greatly if you think the bottom end roster players are gonna leave from their school to go find a roster spot. And even if they did, they aren't going to make a on field impact. It's just shuffling third stringers.

Or a public school stud who goes both ways now but has to more seriously consider if he's limited to one side of ball which opportunity will give him most exposure.

You're acting like these schools student athletes are D1 athletes tied to a athletic scholarship that they can't leave (pre portal days). In zero way is that's what is happening. If their local public school can offer then something they can't they are 1000% percent free to leave.

 

[Snetsrak61]

Oh wait now I see the roster limit doesn't apply to public schools.

Every new detail I learn about this asinine idea I feel more vindicated in rushing through it the first time.

 

[Travelin Fan]

So easily predicted when you're over the target. Obviously the current multiplier is working 🤣. If its a level playing field everyone wants then this is spot on. Limiting players to one side of the ball will make some players think twice about where they want to go. Face it the youth programs that the private schools are hand picking from are selling the scholarship route to the top tier players. If roster limits are known ahead of time, then some of those players will take their talents elsewhere. This is when OP rosters start to balance out.

LOL. "People think my idea is dumb, therefore I must be right!" is such a strange stance to take...

 

[Gestalt45]

Totally disagree. You have to set a culture and kids still need to follow and believe. Not any coach can win a state title.

^^^

He’s a guy that doesn’t get it. Not hard to plug and play D1 kids on your team. The majority of HS coaches could have won a state title with his roster

^^ this is nonsense. Bolingbrook is a great example.

 

[sac'em]

Sac’em,

If that concrete was a solid base I’m good with that. The problem really is that the foundation is not on bedrock but rather quicksand because of the way the students get pushed through the system. Compound that push through the system with it occurring at a higher rate in the failing districts and it points to the core of my complaint. There is no accountability and competition brings accountability into the fold. I think ultimately we both want the kids to have better, you seem to think the current system is good while I feel it tends to be good only in some places and horrible in others, and that those others tend to be in places that can least afford deficiencies or kids falling through the cracks in the system. We probably are much closer to agreement then either of us think, so I’m asking you to look, see, acknowledge, and tell me how you correct the failures in the system.

I agree with most of the premise, however, I will say that there is some level of accountability. The problem is that the decision makers on the school board or in the district office hold the wrong people accountable. They often go after the teachers or building administrators for the results of the poor decisions made above them. The public needs to hold school board members more accountable. School board members need to hold district admin more accountable.

Correcting failures in the system does not involve a broad solution. Each individual entity (school district) must determine what issues impact them the most and work to solve those issues. No one has the perfect solution.

If I were to start researching potential solutions for improving academic outcomes in a school district, these are the areas I would focus on, along with additional supporting facts that highlight their importance:
1. Address Educational Funding Inequities
Ensure underfunded school districts receive adequate resources to meet the needs of their students.
In Illinois, districts serving the highest percentages of low-income students receive approximately 22% less state and local funding per student than wealthier districts, according to the Education Law Center.
Many schools operate in unsafe, hazardous conditions with little to no support for effective learning. Funding reforms are critical to create safe, well-equipped environments where students can thrive.

2. Prioritize Teacher Support
Offer competitive salaries and benefits to attract and retain high-quality educators, reducing the risk of teacher shortages.
The Learning Policy Institute reports that districts with higher teacher salaries experience lower turnover rates and attract more qualified applicants, directly improving student outcomes.
Lower student-to-teacher ratios in struggling districts to improve individualized attention.
Shift the narrative to stop blaming public schools and teachers for broader societal issues they cannot control.

3. Focus on Future-Ready Education: CTE and STEM
Eliminate over-reliance on rote memorization and emphasize critical thinking and problem-solving skills.
According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, STEM jobs are expected to grow by 8% from 2019 to 2029, faster than non-STEM jobs, with median wages nearly double the national average.
Expand Career and Technical Education (CTE) and STEM programs to prepare students for evolving industries and global competitiveness.

4. Revamp Early Childhood Education
Adopt models inspired by Asian countries emphasizing discipline, routine, teamwork, and play-based learning in Pre-K through 1st grade.
Countries like Japan and South Korea have some of the highest literacy and math proficiency rates globally, attributed to early emphasis on discipline, structure, and collaborative learning.
Promote multilingual development in the early years.
Encourage self-sustaining classrooms where children take on responsibilities such as helping with daily activities, meal preparation, and cleanup.

5. Invest in Community and Parental Engagement
Foster partnerships between schools, families, and the community to support student success.
Research from the Harvard Family Research Project shows that students with engaged parents are 2.6 times more likely to graduate from high school and attend college.
Create programs that encourage parents to take an active role in their child’s education and school activities.

6. Reform Disciplinary Policies
Revise outdated and ineffective disciplinary practices to focus on restorative approaches that foster accountability and growth rather than punitive, menial consequences.
Schools that implement restorative justice practices have seen a 44% reduction in suspension rates, improving student behavior and school climate.

7. Increase Accountability for Truancy
Implement strategies to hold parents accountable for ensuring regular attendance while addressing underlying barriers to student engagement.
Chronic absenteeism affects nearly 8 million U.S. students annually, with long-term effects on academic achievement and graduation rates. Parent accountability programs in some states have reduced truancy rates by as much as 25%.

8. Reinforce the Value of Public Education
Help society recognize that the U.S. public education system has been a cornerstone of the nation’s rise to global prominence. It has fostered widespread literacy, innovation, and economic growth, creating a workforce and citizenry capable of sustaining democracy and global leadership.

 

[Travelin Fan]

I agree with most of the premise, however, I will say that there is some level of accountability. The problem is that the decision makers on the school board or in the district office hold the wrong people accountable. They often go after the teachers or building administrators for the results of the poor decisions made above them. The public needs to hold school board members more accountable. School board members need to hold district admin more accountable.

Correcting failures in the system does not involve a broad solution. Each individual entity (school district) must determine what issues impact them the most and work to solve those issues. No one has the perfect solution.

If I were to start researching potential solutions for improving academic outcomes in a school district, these are the areas I would focus on, along with additional supporting facts that highlight their importance:
1. Address Educational Funding Inequities
Ensure underfunded school districts receive adequate resources to meet the needs of their students.
In Illinois, districts serving the highest percentages of low-income students receive approximately 22% less state and local funding per student than wealthier districts, according to the Education Law Center.
Many schools operate in unsafe, hazardous conditions with little to no support for effective learning. Funding reforms are critical to create safe, well-equipped environments where students can thrive.

2. Prioritize Teacher Support
Offer competitive salaries and benefits to attract and retain high-quality educators, reducing the risk of teacher shortages.
The Learning Policy Institute reports that districts with higher teacher salaries experience lower turnover rates and attract more qualified applicants, directly improving student outcomes.
Lower student-to-teacher ratios in struggling districts to improve individualized attention.
Shift the narrative to stop blaming public schools and teachers for broader societal issues they cannot control.

3. Focus on Future-Ready Education: CTE and STEM
Eliminate over-reliance on rote memorization and emphasize critical thinking and problem-solving skills.
According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, STEM jobs are expected to grow by 8% from 2019 to 2029, faster than non-STEM jobs, with median wages nearly double the national average.
Expand Career and Technical Education (CTE) and STEM programs to prepare students for evolving industries and global competitiveness.

4. Revamp Early Childhood Education
Adopt models inspired by Asian countries emphasizing discipline, routine, teamwork, and play-based learning in Pre-K through 1st grade.
Countries like Japan and South Korea have some of the highest literacy and math proficiency rates globally, attributed to early emphasis on discipline, structure, and collaborative learning.
Promote multilingual development in the early years.
Encourage self-sustaining classrooms where children take on responsibilities such as helping with daily activities, meal preparation, and cleanup.

5. Invest in Community and Parental Engagement
Foster partnerships between schools, families, and the community to support student success.
Research from the Harvard Family Research Project shows that students with engaged parents are 2.6 times more likely to graduate from high school and attend college.
Create programs that encourage parents to take an active role in their child’s education and school activities.

6. Reform Disciplinary Policies
Revise outdated and ineffective disciplinary practices to focus on restorative approaches that foster accountability and growth rather than punitive, menial consequences.
Schools that implement restorative justice practices have seen a 44% reduction in suspension rates, improving student behavior and school climate.

7. Increase Accountability for Truancy
Implement strategies to hold parents accountable for ensuring regular attendance while addressing underlying barriers to student engagement.
Chronic absenteeism affects nearly 8 million U.S. students annually, with long-term effects on academic achievement and graduation rates. Parent accountability programs in some states have reduced truancy rates by as much as 25%.

8. Reinforce the Value of Public Education
Help society recognize that the U.S. public education system has been a cornerstone of the nation’s rise to global prominence. It has fostered widespread literacy, innovation, and economic growth, creating a workforce and citizenry capable of sustaining democracy and global leadership.

Yeah but what about 3-4 vs 4-3 vs 3-3-5 stack?

 

[sac'em]

Yeah but what about 3-4 vs 4-3 vs 3-3-5 stack?

That mostly depends on personnel. Run a 3-man front if you got a NG that can handle 2-gap play. Then decide if you are heavy in LBs or DBs. 4-man front is nice if you want to stop the run first and not have to blitz for a pass rush. Most HS coaches run what ever they know with little regard for personnel.