Getting your brains beat in by the bigger Catholic schools in sports does not help matters either for those schools. The CCL almost completely broke apart because no one wanted to be the 6th team in the CCL Blue for years.
IHSA Proposals Are Out
- Thread starter DJrodey24
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Getting your brains beat in by the bigger Catholic schools in sports does not help matters either for those schools. The CCL almost completely broke apart because no one wanted to be the 6th team in the CCL Blue for years.
But then they wouldn’t be bound to the 5 win playoff rule which is what they really hated not having a chance at.
Private high school Sports existed before 1974 and will be even easier in the computer age to manage disparity efficiently and come up with playoff qualifying rules and classes that work for those developing programs.
Pay the hard to get officials more money a game, corner their attention after not being treated well by the high fee IHSA. Leave coaches reffing public games.
The ideas are flowing. Maybe I’ll be the commissioner. it’s just comfortable enough to endure its shortcomings for now.
Public schools in Texas cheat more than any type of school anywhere else.
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Pump the breaks on Rochester. They’ve been one of the largest 4A’s for a while and happened to get bumped this year. They likely back in 4A next year and never voluntarily moved up. They are the epitome of the success factor’s fatal flaw.
Why not have 1 bracket for private? Why pussify it so the little guys can feel good about them selves? 64 teams 1 private champion.
Well who exactly would they have to play in the playoffs every year if the private schools left? Hint, it is not Bremen, Sandburg or Peotone.
As if the status quo doesn’t have a bevy of problems. I get it. You’re a great poster. I know where you stand on the issue and it was a great debate. I bow out. A) to let the ones that get paid to think about this stuff figure it out and B) sleep.
Seriously, good stuff
I just hope they are not stupid enough to vote to divide Public & Private. I enjoy competing with players that really want to go to school at JCA, not a team of Greater Joliet Area All-stars that are more like hired guns.
But the Privates will do what they have to, to survive.
But the Privates will do what they have to, to survive.
I’ve explained this about 1,000 times on here but.... in Texas all the traditional powers are the public’s and that’s their history so being the public school champ is sexier and no one is saying yeah but Allen or Southlake Carroll or Duncanville or Austin Westlake didn’t have to beat private team X so how do we know they are the best. Which do you think is perceived as the “sexier” or better group in Illinois? Mt Carmel, Loyola, Jca, Montini, Nazareth, etc or the public’s? Long story short, it would make people question the quality of the public champion and people would be more interested in the private side. I would even bet it would drive many more kids who care about football to
I’ve explained this about 1,000 times on here but.... in Texas all the traditional powers are the public’s and that’s their history so being the public school champ is sexier and no one is saying yeah but Allen or Southlake Carroll or Duncanville or Austin Westlake didn’t have to beat private team X so how do we know they are the best. Which do you think is perceived as the “sexier” or better group in Illinois? Mt Carmel, Loyola, Jca, Montini, Nazareth, etc or the public’s? Long story short, it would make people question the quality of the public champion and people would be more interested in the private side. I would even bet it would drive many more kids who care about football to the private’s.
Plenty of top public’s
LWE, MS, HF, WWS, GW, HC, Warren, NV, Oswego
BB among others. Sorry if I left anyone out.
LWE, MS, HF, WWS, GW, HC, Warren, NV, Oswego
BB among others. Sorry if I left anyone out.
Point has validity, but I think only for the largest public schools. I don’t believe many smaller and mid size public schools have aspirations or concerns about being the best overall or best regardless of class, etc...
Just my opinion.
It's just something they say without facts to back them up.
2018 - private
2017 - public
2016 - public
2015 - private
2014 - public
2013 - private
2012 - public
2011 - public
2010 - public
2009 - public
2008 - public
2007 - public
2006 - public
2005 - public
2004 - public
2003 - they say CoM but Lockport would have won
2002 - public
2001 - public
2000 - public
1999 - public
1998 - they said MC but I call a tie with WWS
1997 - public
1996 - again with the MC v WWS
1995 - public
1994 - public
1993 - public
Yes they would, just in a new class.
Large Private would be 11A
Middle Private would be 10A
Small Private would be 9A
St. Liz you igneous son of a slab. Stoned Lizard and RockSoup, I can see the geologic resemblance.
My entire point was “perception” of the sexier/better programs. I specifically used the word perceived. And perception would be all that matters when you are separate and can’t prove otherwise on the field.
Additionally, all your list does is further help make my point that they shouldn’t separate public/private as there is no need. The people that make these proposals to the ihsa for separation are public school officials not private.
I guess we have different perceptions. I think clearly the #1 team would usually be on the public side. But the more consistent programs would be on the private side, however this would start to change once the hierarchy is established and you're no longer able to beat on smaller public's.
As I've said over and over I prefer them together personally. I love that HF Loyola matchup or that LWE MC matchup, but just as much as I like those I hate the Montinis and JCAs in 5A matchups. And I don't see a way to objectively fix it (which doesn't mean there isn't a way), and when we do things subjectively too much bias is involved.
non boundaried= Simeon/Phillips and most charter schools dancing with the privates if separation.
IMO, your statistics don’t even scratch the surface of the entire story.
There is a high invariance in the private schools accounting for those championships, where as there is a high variance in the public schools accounting for those championships.
The ability to recruit provides a competitive advantage, especially in terms of program consistency, plain and simple. Disagree? Let’s argue.
If anything, your post only indicates that the public school programs must be a bit superior due to having to coach-up the limited pool of kids that they have and still be consistently competitive. The LWEs, HFs, ESLs, Simeons, Batavias, etc.
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Wouldn't the upper private class just be a do over of the ccl/escc regular season? Is there another large school private conference? What would the bracket look like this year?
Seems like it'd be kind of boring same old same old for the kids. Not that I'm looking forward to it but things go caulk 1st rd be quite different rita going to sterling next week.
Seems like it'd be kind of boring same old same old for the kids. Not that I'm looking forward to it but things go caulk 1st rd be quite different rita going to sterling next week.
1. Not my stats I used the numbers in the most recent proposal for a split as provided by a public school administrator.
2. Define recruit. Is Batavia’s starting Junior QB a recruit? He spent the previous 2 seasons at Neuqua Valley. Was the OPRF wrestling roster that dominated the state for a few years and filled with kids who moved into OPRF from: Plainfield, Joliet, maywood, Hoffman estates, among several other towns a group of recruits? Is the star basketball player at Whitney Young who who transferred to WY from Fenwick a recruit? Was the star running back at Glenbard West last year who was from River Forest through 8th grade a recruit? Should I go on?
3. Limited pool of kids at LWE, H-F, among the others.... are you kidding? Cuz I laughed.
I don’t debate people who are clearly ridiculous as it gets too frustrating.
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If Simeon/Phillips are non boundaried, aren’t all CPS schools non boundaried?
What am I thinking, the other CPS schools are considered pushovers so no one has a problem with them being in the boundaried pool with everyone else.
Fully get that but who would we actually trust to do that in a decent manner?
Just to be clear, private schools aren't the sexiest in Illinois outside of the Edgytim board.
Regarding the Carlinville proposal to separate boundaried and non-boundaried...
GIVE ME THE NIPL!
GIVE ME THE NIPL!
Just to be clear, if Althoff gets spring ball, can do things a bit different ... and gets a new coach ... the BiState is going to be full - going east and west - bringing kids to 5401 W. Main Street.
In that separation proposal, there was NO MENTION of any of the limiting rules and regs that apply to private schools only.
Why would private schools want to remain in an association with separate playoffs for boundaried and non-boundaried (read private) schools when said association STILL maintains rules and regulations that are designed to limit their competitiveness against boundaried public schools in the playoffs?
Seriously, that's pretty ballsy of the school making this proposal. More than likely, the person who wrote the proposal didn't even give it a thought. Because if s/he had thought of it, and STILL kept those rules and regs in place, then that just boggles the mind.
Give me the NIPL! Give me athletic scholarships! Give me no success factors, no multipliers, no 30 mile radii, no discriminatory transfer rules, and no restrictions on recruiting athletically.
Let the market decide.
Why would private schools want to remain in an association with separate playoffs for boundaried and non-boundaried (read private) schools when said association STILL maintains rules and regulations that are designed to limit their competitiveness against boundaried public schools in the playoffs?
Seriously, that's pretty ballsy of the school making this proposal. More than likely, the person who wrote the proposal didn't even give it a thought. Because if s/he had thought of it, and STILL kept those rules and regs in place, then that just boggles the mind.
Give me the NIPL! Give me athletic scholarships! Give me no success factors, no multipliers, no 30 mile radii, no discriminatory transfer rules, and no restrictions on recruiting athletically.
Let the market decide.
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As someone stated earlier regarding something of this nature... nope! If you want separate you get separate. No end of year private vs public ultimate champion crap. You can have your public title and the private can have theirs and let people wonder. You want to play private’s then drop the separation crap. The game you propose is like a boy wrestling a girl. Win-win for the girl and lose-lose for the boy. If the public wins it will be hey look how good we are see you private’s aren’t all that and if you lose it will be hey you guys recruit or give scholarships or have kids from 30 miles away and excuse after excuse. So it’s a no lose situation for the public team so I say the private’s shouldnt give them that opportunity.
Althoff won't get spring ball because other sports like Basketball will be all year as well. Most football kids don't want to play spring ball, it's more the coaches.
