Bears

[4Afan]

Listen you have only 1 #1 you have how many all others in every years draft. I mean you have to count all of them against 1. It’s not even close. How about you say all the #1,2,3,4.5 see how they compare to all ? Maybe I am misunderstanding your logic.

Ok, let's look at active QBs. Here is who I think are the top 15 QBs in the league right now in no particular order with their draft round and overall pick number listed, just listed them as they came to me. Where would you rate the QBs taken #1 overall? Would any of them be considered to be a top 5 QB in the league?

Patrick Mahomes 1-9
Lamar Jackson 1-32
Dak Prescott 4-135
Josh Allen 1-7
Matthew Stafford 1-1
Tua Tagovailoa 1-5
Jared Goff 1-1
Brock Purdy 7-259
CJ Stroud 1-2
Jordan Love 1-26
Jalen Hurts 2-53
Joe Burrow 1-1
Trevor Lawrence 1-1
Justin Herbert 1-6
Kirk Cousins 4-102

 

[4Afan]

Listen you have only 1 #1 you have how many all others in every years draft. I mean you have to count all of them against 1. It’s not even close. How about you say all the #1,2,3,4.5 see how they compare to all ? Maybe I am misunderstanding your logic.

My original point is that #1 overall QBs miss on a far great rate than they hit.

 

[corey90]

My original point is that #1 overall QBs miss on a far great rate than they hit.

Sure
If you take the number of non #1 in each years draft they miss more. Example how many QBs drafted non #1 does it take to find a Patrick Mahomes. It’s a scary number I am sure. I understand what your trying to say and agree #1 isn’t a guarantee and it certainly doesn’t always work out but trying to draft a QB in the later rounds hoping he could be a franchise quarterback is even more of a gamble. None of them are a guarantee but I like the odds better at picking #1.

 

[4Afan]

Sure
If you take the number of non #1 in each years draft they miss more. Example how many QBs drafted non #1 does it take to find a Patrick Mahomes. It’s a scary number I am sure. I understand what your trying to say and agree #1 isn’t a guarantee and it certainly doesn’t always work out but trying to draft a QB in the later rounds hoping he could be a franchise quarterback is even more of a gamble. None of them are a guarantee but I like the odds better at picking #1.

Look at my list of top 15 QBs. How many of the #1 overall picks would you say are even top 5 in the league right now? It's not just finding a Mahomes, Lamar has 2 MVPs and was pick 32, Love was 26n Hurts was 2nd round.

 

[stl705]

Look at my list of top 15 QBs. How many of the #1 overall picks would you say are even top 5 in the league right now? It's not just finding a Mahomes, Lamar has 2 MVPs and was pick 32, Love was 26n Hurts was 2nd round.

4A - you are comparing the number of starting QBs from 1 pick vs 255 picks in the draft. Of course there are more top 15 QBs taken from the 255 picks (2-256 overall) than 1 overall. Nobody is arguing with you there. I don’t think you are getting my original argument but thats ok. Go Bears lol.

 

[SiuCubFan8]

I’d change argument to first QB drafted rather than 1/1…

 

[4Afan]

4A - you are comparing the number of starting QBs from 1 pick vs 255 picks in tnr draft. Of course there are more top 15 QBs taken from the 255 picks (2-256 overall) than 1 overall. Nobody is arguing with you there. I don’t think you are getting my original argument but thats ok. Go Bears lol.

Every stat you can find shows #1 overall QBs are by far best bet for your money and produce at a far higher clip than any other QB draft spot

Your original point was that your odds of finding a successful QB were better at #1 overall than any other draft position so I'm comparing any other draft position to the #1 overall.

Yes, #1 overall is going to have better stats than any one specific spot in the draft, but your logic is flawed because #1 overall QB is the most popular spot for a QB to be taken so yes, #1 overall throughout history has performed better than say 6th overall and that's due to a much smaller number being taken at that specific spot.

 

[SiuCubFan8]

Your original point was that your odds of finding a successful QB were better at #1 overall than any other draft position so I'm comparing any other draft position to the #1 overall.

Yes, #1 overall is going to have better stats than any one specific spot in the draft, but your logic is flawed because #1 overall QB is the most popular spot for a QB to be taken so yes, #1 overall throughout history has performed better than say 6th overall and that's due to a much smaller number being taken at that specific spot.

Honestly, do the numbers backup that #1 is the most popular spot for a QB to be taken?

 

[4Afan]

Honestly, do the numbers backup that #1 is the most popular spot for a QB to be taken?

Yep. Agreed with your last post about first QB vs. 1/1 and just looked and over the last 25 years and 1/1 was overwhelmingly where the first QB was taken.

 

[SiuCubFan8]

This is normal leading up to draft stuff/garbage.
Williams has been the overwhelming #1 pick for two years now. Nothing has happened to change that…including combine.
Don’t get cute, take him and let’s see what happens.

If you believe in Fields+haul from trading 1/1….fine I’m good with that but don’t try and get cute with a different QB.

 

[4Afan]

This is normal leading up to draft stuff/garbage.
Williams has been the overwhelming #1 pick for two years now. Nothing has happened to change that…including combine.
Don’t get cute, take him and let’s see what happens.

If you believe in Fields+haul from trading 1/1….fine I’m good with that but don’t try and get cute with a different QB.

Still don't get the hype with Williams. What am I missing? Multiple QBs in this draft had better numbers then he did and USCs defense was awful so he was constantly having to score and still got out perfromed by guys like Nix who sat out the 4th quarter of multiple games. He'a good and a great athlete but I fail to see how he's the consensus #1 and a "generational talent".

I think with those expectations and being #1 overall you need to be more mentally strong than physically strong to live up to the hype and succeed in the NFL and I see big red flags between this kids ears.

I stand by my original draft assessment, draft Harrison #1 because he's the best player in the draft, don't get cute, and get an Edge at #9. Use whatever they have left to trade up as high as they can in the 2nd and take Penix or Nix to sit behind Fields for a year. I like Penix for his upside and Nix for his experience and accuracy.

 

[SiuCubFan8]

Still don't get the hype with Williams. What am I missing? Multiple QBs in this draft had better numbers then he did and USCs defense was awful so he was constantly having to score and still got out perfromed by guys like Nix who sat out the 4th quarter of multiple games. He'a good and a great athlete but I fail to see how he's the consensus #1 and a "generational talent".

I think with those expectations and being #1 overall you need to be more mentally strong than physically strong to live up to the hype and succeed in the NFL and I see big red flags between this kids ears.

I stand by my original draft assessment, draft Harrison #1 because he's the best player in the draft, don't get cute, and get an Edge at #9. Use whatever they have left to trade up as high as they can in the 2nd and take Penix or Nix to sit behind Fields for a year. I like Penix for his upside and Nix for his experience and accuracy.

If you don’t see it that’s fine, I don’t put a ton of stock in college numbers.

 

[4Afan]

If you don’t see it that’s fine, I don’t put a ton of stock in college numbers.

Lol, I mean isn't that how players are evaluated and drafted?

So what is it you see in him that signifies future greatness?

 

[SiuCubFan8]

Lol, I mean isn't that how players are evaluated and drafted?

So what is it you see in him that signifies future greatness?

You think they are evaluated and drafted based on college stats?

Arm strength, accuracy, mobility, ability to change arm angle, ability to make plays, he’s show ability to read the field.

I do think his biggest weakness is confidence in arm…can’t always fit it in every tight spot.

 

[4Afan]

You think they are evaluated and drafted based on college stats?

Not exclusively, but it's a big factor. If not for his numbers please explain the Williams hype.

 

[SiuCubFan8]

Not exclusively, but it's a big factor. If not for his numbers please explain the Williams hype.

nfl teams spends millions on scouting, networks spend millions on analysts and you think a big factor is their stats?????? Seriously? I don’t agree with you at times but I always kinda see your point but I’m lost on this one.

The tape……….

 

[4Afan]

nfl teams spends millions on scouting, networks spend millions on analysts and you think a big factor is their stats?????? Seriously? I don’t agree with you at times but I always kinda see your point but I’m lost on this one.

The tape……….

Analysts? Lol, the talking heads are the last thing I listen to. here's how I would rank how players are evaluated.

-opportunity for growth. How high is their ceiling? And for QBs, their mechanics. This is where scounting comes in the most. 45%

-physical attributes 15%

-system in college. Tommy Chang had a million yards but Hawaii ran the run and shoot or a great RB from an option team doesn't translate to the NFL. 10%

-performance in college (the numbers) 25%

-intangibles (coachability, off field issues, etc.) 5%

 

[SiuCubFan8]

Analysts? Lol, the talking heads are the last thing I listen to. here's how I would rank how players are evaluated.

-opportunity for growth. How high is their ceiling? And for QBs, their mechanics. This is where scounting comes in the most. 45%

-physical attributes 15%

-system in college. Tommy Chang had a million yards but Hawaii ran the run and shoot or a great RB from an option team doesn't translate to the NFL. 10%

-performance in college (the numbers) 25%

-intangibles (coachability, off field issues, etc.) 5%

So you said stats are a big factor then say it’s 25%? If you stated that % off the bat I probably wouldn’t have said a thing. I still think that’s high but not gonna quibble over 25% much.

I think you aren’t factoring floor. Williams floor is high, that matters when evaluating .

It’s pointless exercise. You don’t believe he’s the guy and I do…..around we can go around and around for 40+ days.

 

[4Afan]

It’s pointless exercise. You don’t believe he’s the guy and I do…..around we can go around and around for 40+ days.

And that's the beauty of the lead up to the draft!

Everything we've all been discussing could be hot garbage and change dramatically in a week once free agency starts and teams starts filling their needs that way.

What are your reasons for thinking Williams is going to live up to the hype? I agree he has a high floor, but I don't see his ceiling as being that high.

 

[corey90]

And that's the beauty of the lead up to the draft!

Everything we've all been discussing could be hot garbage and change dramatically in a week once free agency starts and teams starts filling their needs that way.

What are your reasons for thinking Williams is going to live up to the hype? I agree he has a high floor, but I don't see his ceiling as being that high.

A4 it’s funny you keep talking about his ceiling yet their is no measurable to gauge his ceiling or any other players ceiling. It’s a guess at best. Williams won the Heisman trophy and came back the next year on track to win it again. His numbers were still one of the best in college football. How it translates in the NFL? We will see because he is going to be picked and most likely #1. If not by the Bears by another team the Bears trade with. You seem to believe in Fields yet what has he shown us the past 3 years? Nothing! I bet you think his ceiling is high. Lol

 

[Wassup13]

You guys put me to sleep.

 

[DadCoachSports]

Still don't get the hype with Williams. What am I missing? Multiple QBs in this draft had better numbers then he did and USCs defense was awful so he was constantly having to score and still got out perfromed by guys like Nix who sat out the 4th quarter of multiple games. He'a good and a great athlete but I fail to see how he's the consensus #1 and a "generational talent".

I think with those expectations and being #1 overall you need to be more mentally strong than physically strong to live up to the hype and succeed in the NFL and I see big red flags between this kids ears.

I stand by my original draft assessment, draft Harrison #1 because he's the best player in the draft, don't get cute, and get an Edge at #9. Use whatever they have left to trade up as high as they can in the 2nd and take Penix or Nix to sit behind Fields for a year. I like Penix for his upside and Nix for his experience and accuracy.

1. Penix and Nix will both be drafted in the 1st Round.

2. Caleb Williams was the #2 QB in his HS Class of 2021 behind Quinn Ewers. Has been the #1 ranked college QB the last 2 years in college football. He has been under a microscope and has done nothing but impress.

3. Fields is not a NFL QB. Hasnt the trade market proved that. If teams wanted him as their starter they would be offering up draft picks for him.

 

[stripes13]

You've been given a gift as picking #1 when you're not the type of team that should be picking #1. If anyone can actually make a football argument as to why Poles should not draft Caleb Williams I'll listen. Unfortunately, all we've gotten so far are TMZ-esque "red flags" that in any other year wouldn't be that big of a concern.

Except, Caleb has a sportsdad for a father and he's really the first NCAA superstar in the NIL/Portal era. So that in and of itself is going to draw extra scrutiny from fans. I think there is a major generational factor that should be taken into account with some of the criticism that he's getting from NFL people, but I'm going to keep this to myself.

Yeah, this mythical "The Haul" that could be gotten from trading the #1 overall pick might be great. Might be a once in a lifetime haul. Unfortunately, quarterback is either the most important position in all of sports, or it isn't the most important position in all of sports. Things would be different if Justin Fields (who I desperately wanted to be the guy) showed that he could become a pocket passer. He didn't.

This really shouldn't be a hard decision.

 

[4Afan]

You've been given a gift as picking #1 when you're not the type of team that should be picking #1. If anyone can actually make a football argument as to why Poles should not draft Caleb Williams I'll listen. Unfortunately, all we've gotten so far are TMZ-esque "red flags" that in any other year wouldn't be that big of a concern.

Ok, football wise I think he's undersized for an NFL QB, I don't like the way he holds the ball when he runs (17 fumbles over 3 years), I think he doesn't need to make as many impromptu plays as he does I think he missed his initial or secondary open target, he's too full of himself (first prospect ever to not submit to medical exam at the combine), and I don't think he has the mental make up for an NFL QB. You call it TMZ-esque, but why do teams conduct interviews with these players? Because that stuff also matters.

Your turn. What makes you so certain he's a generational talent? I've asked multiple times and no one has offered their insight.

You wanted Fields to develop into a pocket passer and he hasn't, but Williams isn't a pocket passer either so why is he the guy?

 

[SiuCubFan8]

Ok, football wise I think he's undersized for an NFL QB, I don't like the way he holds the ball when he runs (17 fumbles over 3 years), I think he doesn't need to make as many impromptu plays as he does I think he missed his initial or secondary open target, he's too full of himself (first prospect ever to not submit to medical exam at the combine), and I don't think he has the mental make up for an NFL QB. You call it TMZ-esque, but why do teams conduct interviews with these players? Because that stuff also matters.

Your turn. What makes you so certain he's a generational talent? I've asked multiple times and no one has offered their insight.

You wanted Fields to develop into a pocket passer and he hasn't, but Williams isn't a pocket passer either so why is he the guy?

I offered insight on why I believe he’s going to be good.

 

[4Afan]

I offered insight on why I believe he’s going to be good.

You did? Just searched your posts back to the beginning of February and I don't see a football breakdown of why you think Williams is the consensus #1, generational talent.

What has he done that is so much better than the other QB prospects that puts him head and shoulders above everyone else?

 

[SiuCubFan8]

You did? Just searched your posts back to the beginning of February and I don't see a football breakdown of why you think Williams is the consensus #1, generational talent.

What has he done that is so much better than the other QB prospects that puts him head and shoulders above everyone else?

I wrote this yesterday, granted it"s not some in depth scouting report....

Arm strength, accuracy, mobility, ability to change arm angle, ability to make plays, he’s show ability to read the field.

 

[stripes13]

Ok, football wise I think he's undersized for an NFL QB, I don't like the way he holds the ball when he runs (17 fumbles over 3 years), I think he doesn't need to make as many impromptu plays as he does I think he missed his initial or secondary open target, he's too full of himself (first prospect ever to not submit to medical exam at the combine), and I don't think he has the mental make up for an NFL QB. You call it TMZ-esque, but why do teams conduct interviews with these players? Because that stuff also matters.

Your turn. What makes you so certain he's a generational talent? I've asked multiple times and no one has offered their insight.

You wanted Fields to develop into a pocket passer and he hasn't, but Williams isn't a pocket passer either so why is he the guy?

Well first of all, I've never used the word "generational" to describe Williams. I think that word is thrown around haphazardly.

Second, he measured exactly the same height and weight as Drew Brees. Did you think Drew Brees was undersized for the NFL?

Third, teams invest millions of dollars into these players. I'm only investing my time. It makes sense for teams to interview them, for you and me? It means nothing. I've never had an issue separating what happens on the field vs off the field. Three-A: saying "he's too full of himself" is the same stuff I'm talking about that doesn't matter. That said: show me a player that goes #1 overall in any sport and I'll show you a guy who is full of themselves.

Fourth, yeah those 17 fumbles over 3 years is certainly concerning. Another way of saying "17 fumbles over 3 years" is half of what Justin Fields had over the same amount of time. If protecting the football is a concern of yours, well, wait until you meet the current QB1.

 

[4Afan]

Second, he measured exactly the same height and weight as Drew Brees. Did you think Drew Brees was undersized for the NFL?

Thought you would have gone with a current QB at his height like Purdy, Tua, or Hurts, but Brees it the typical go to whenever size comes up. Brees is the exception not the rule.

Three-A: saying "he's too full of himself" is the same stuff I'm talking about that doesn't matter. That said: show me a player that goes #1 overall in any sport and I'll show you a guy who is full of themselves.

Yes, this stuff matters whether you see it or not. Matthew Stafford doesn't come across as full of himself, neither does Trevor Lawrence, Burrow, and Goff don't come across as full of themselves either. Teams interview players to look for character flaws and to see if they have what it takes to be successful, see Jameis Winston. Per your words, teams invest millions in this stuff. Would they do that if it doesn't matter?

Fourth, yeah those 17 fumbles over 3 years is certainly concerning. Another way of saying "17 fumbles over 3 years" is half of what Justin Fields had over the same amount of time. If protecting the football is a concern of yours, well, wait until you meet the current QB1.

You're just proving my point with this one. Most people want to move on from Fields for Williams and you use a negative stat to compare why he's the better option. Not exactly a glowing recommendation for Williams.

 

[4Afan]

I wrote this yesterday, granted it"s not some in depth scouting report....

Arm strength, accuracy, mobility, ability to change arm angle, ability to make plays, he’s show ability to read the field.

Funny you mention these specific traits because an article just came out on Bleacher Report comparing Williams to Maye and they give the edge to Maye in a few of those categories. It won't let me post the link here but it's worth a read.

I'm still waiting for someone to help educate me as to why Williams is the consensus #1 pick and head and shoulders above everyone else.

I can see why people like Williams, just not why they think he's the no brainer #1 guy.

 

[colin2229]

Analysts? Lol, the talking heads are the last thing I listen to. here's how I would rank how players are evaluated.

-opportunity for growth. How high is their ceiling? And for QBs, their mechanics. This is where scounting comes in the most. 45%

-physical attributes 15%

-system in college. Tommy Chang had a million yards but Hawaii ran the run and shoot or a great RB from an option team doesn't translate to the NFL. 10%

-performance in college (the numbers) 25%

-intangibles (coachability, off field issues, etc.) 5%

Intangibles is #1....by a wide margin. Everything is overhyped by the media and guru's.

It's debatable but the (3) best QB's off all time are probably - Tom Brady, Joe Montana & Peyton Manning. None had rocket arms or were athletic. But they had great intangibles, great leaders and extremely intelligent. They made everyone around them better. Brock Purdy is now doing the same things with a similar talent level.

That's what makes great QB's and what makes people nervous about Caleb Williams. We just don't know if he's a great leader with great intangibles. This is why I'm pretty open to trading the pick and taking another QB later while also stock piling more picks.

 

[4Afan]

Intangibles is #1....by a wide margin. Everything is overhyped by the media and guru's.

It's debatable but the (3) best QB's off all time are probably - Tom Brady, Joe Montana & Peyton Manning. None had rocket arms or were athletic. But they had great intangibles, great leaders and extremely intelligent. They made everyone around them better. Brock Purdy is now doing the same things with a similar talent level.

That's what makes great QB's and what makes people nervous about Caleb Williams. We just don't know if he's a great leader with great intangibles. This is why I'm pretty open to trading the pick and taking another QB later while also stock piling more picks.

I get what you're saying, but not having a rocket arm or being super athletic are the reasons Brady fell to the 6th round and Montana was taken in the 3rd round. If they had better arms or were more athletic they would have been taken higher which is why intangibles aren't weighed as heavily in my opinion.

 

[corey90]

4Afan
We know you hate Williams and you will try to sway anything he’s accomplished to fit your belief. I guess all the scouts throughout the country are wrong and you’re right. It’s tough to read some of your long rambling posts. What are you going to do when the Bears pick him? Root against him to fit your narrative. You can’t possibly have an open mind. I on the other hand think he is worth taking a chance on, but if the Bears do pick another QB or stick with Fields I will root for them unless the are flat out awful. In any case carry on. By the way if the Bears trade the #1 I don’t believe they will get all the draft picks as some suggest. The Bears best chance is to trade Fields to secure a few draft picks or try to move up from #9.

 

[4Afan]

4Afan
We know you hate Williams and you will try to sway anything he’s accomplished to fit your belief. I guess all the scouts throughout the country are wrong and you’re right. It’s tough to read some of your long rambling posts. What are you going to do when the Bears pick him? Root against him to fit your narrative. You can’t possibly have an open mind. I on the other hand think he is worth taking a chance on, but if the Bears do pick another QB or stick with Fields I will root for them unless the are flat out awful. In any case carry on. By the way if the Bears trade the #1 I don’t believe they will get all the draft picks as some suggest. The Bears best chance is to trade Fields to secure a few draft picks or try to move up from #9.

Of course I'll root for him and I've repeatedly said I hope I'm wrong and I want someone to educate me on why he's so special, but no one has.

You say he's worth taking a chance on. I'm sorry, but you don't "take a chance" on a #1 pick.

I think you have it slightly backwards regarding trading #1 or Fields. WIlliams is going #1, either to the Bears or someone else and thst team, depending on where they are currently drafting, will trade more picks then the Bears will get for Fields. Once free agency starts Fields trade value goes down.

Wouldn't mind seeing them trade up from #9, but it depends on what they get for Fields because as it stands now they only have 5 picks and if they trade up that's gonna cost them more picks. I honestly think it's becoming more and more likely they trade back from #9 so Poles can aquire more picks. The dream of Odunze is fading by the day as it appears he won't still be there at #9.

 

[corey90]

Of course I'll root for him and I've repeatedly said I hope I'm wrong and I want someone to educate me on why he's so special, but no one has.

You say he's worth taking a chance on. I'm sorry, but you don't "take a chance" on a #1 pick.

I think you have it slightly backwards regarding trading #1 or Fields. WIlliams is going #1, either to the Bears or someone else and thst team, depending on where they are currently drafting, will trade more picks then the Bears will get for Fields. Once free agency starts Fields trade value goes down.

Wouldn't mind seeing them trade up from #9, but it depends on what they get for Fields because as it stands now they only have 5 picks and if they trade up that's gonna cost them more picks. I honestly think it's becoming more and more likely they trade back from #9 so Poles can aquire more picks. The dream of Odunze is fading by the day as it appears he won't still be there at #9.

Every team picking in the draft is taking a chance regardless of it being #1. Honestly Subcubfan said it pretty well in Williams. It’s his intangibles! Throwing on the run with accuracy, different arm angles, throws with touch on the ball, moves around in the pocket to buy time for receiver to get open, checks off primary receivers and finds open alternative receiver. He has very good arm strength. Very intelligent, he is a leader and absolutely wants to win. High passion to play well and have his team play well. What I was trying to say is I don’t think the Bears will get the haul of draft picks people think if they trade the #1. I team has to really fall in love with Williams and have the draft picks to trade. I mean if the Bears trade #1 for a few low round picks I will not be happy. I have repeatedly the Bears need to add talented impact players no matter what position they draft. We have a bunch of average every day players. Now’s the time to add a few game changers. Williams and Odumze would be perfect in my opinion.

 

[4Afan]

Every team picking in the draft is taking a chance regardless of it being #1. Honestly Subcubfan said it pretty well in Williams. It’s his intangibles! Throwing on the run with accuracy, different arm angles, throws with touch on the ball, moves around in the pocket to buy time for receiver to get open, checks off primary receivers and finds open alternative receiver. He has very good arm strength. Very intelligent, he is a leader and absolutely wants to win. High passion to play well and have his team play well. What I was trying to say is I don’t think the Bears will get the haul of draft picks people think if they trade the #1. I team has to really fall in love with Williams and have the draft picks to trade. I mean if the Bears trade #1 for a few low round picks I will not be happy. I have repeatedly the Bears need to add talented impact players no matter what position they draft. We have a bunch of average every day players. Now’s the time to add a few game changers. Williams and Odumze would be perfect in my opinion.

Agree with all his attributes you mentioned minus leadership. I don't get that from him at all. The thing is the other prospects have similar attributes and performed better. What makes Williams an alleged slam dunk and head and shoulders above Daniels, Maye, Penix, Nix, and JJ? What is his ceiling? How much better can he get?

If the Bears draft Williams sadly we won't be able to see who was right about him for 3-5 years.

 

[SiuCubFan8]

Agree with all his attributes you mentioned minus leadership. I don't get that from him at all. The thing is the other prospects have similar attributes and performed better. What makes Williams an alleged slam dunk and head and shoulders above Daniels, Maye, Penix, Nix, and JJ? What is his ceiling? How much better can he get?

If the Bears draft Williams sadly we won't be able to see who was right about him for 3-5 years.

I don’t care who right, I just want the Bears to be good.

Edit, I just want Poles to be right!!!

 

[corey90]

Agree with all his attributes you mentioned minus leadership. I don't get that from him at all. The thing is the other prospects have similar attributes and performed better. What makes Williams an alleged slam dunk and head and shoulders above Daniels, Maye, Penix, Nix, and JJ? What is his ceiling? How much better can he get?

If the Bears draft Williams sadly we won't be able to see who was right about him for 3-5 years.

We maybe able to tell after the first year? I expect a lot for a #1 pick. Yes the others you mentioned also have some of the attributes that Williams has IMO he just does it better than the others. You keep asking what his ceiling is? That’s a guess for you me and everyone. If he puts up numbers in the NFL like he did in college I would say we got a very good QB.
Anyway this back and forth has been fun, we both want whoever they pick to be good and make the Bears better. Let’s hope that happens.

 

[Wassup13]

Leadership? I don't think so. If you can't figure that out by now I'm worried about you.

Williams is a problem and the issues keep adding up. He just declined a workout for the Bears.

This divas issues are just going to continue to add up.

 

[stl705]

All his USC teammates at the Combine loved the guy, joking around with him, basically fawning over the guy in interviews. He stayed until the end of the combine reps, cheering on his guys and supporting them.

Where exactly is the lack of leadership and “problems” you guys are talking about? Is it the 7-4 record this year coming off a Heisman? This offseason combine stuff is nonsense. Who cares he skipped the combine workouts? What matters is on the field.

On the field, he showed he had the strongest arm, most accurate arm, and best ability to improvise when faced with breakdowns and pressure. As mentioned he’s got the ability to throw unique angles that Mahomes and Rodgers have. His OL was bad this year. It was average last year and he won a heisman with that and a 1st rd WR weapon. Over his 2.5 years starting, he’s been the best QB on composite average. Better than Penix and Nix over those years, and he’s younger than both.