What's going on at Marian of the Heights?

[ramblinman]

Ten years ago, Marian Catholic had an actual enrollment of 1,573 students and qualified for the 8A playoffs as a multiplied school. That was the year they beat HF in week one, and HF went on to be an 8A semifinalist. Last week, they lost 49-0 at home to Yorkville, a 6A/7A bubble school that is 1-1 so far and was 2-7 last year.

This year, Marian Catholic's IHSA actual enrollment stands at 1001 (which is actually last year's actual enrollment reported to the ISBE). That's a 36% enrollment decline in ten years.

Yikes!

 

[UlbKA91]

Indiana. What's Lake Central, Hanover Central and Lowell's enrollments over that period?

 

[mc140]

White Flight + Bloom showing improvement + HF facilities.

 

[DigitalCy]

Marian Catholic has been a good to great in most of their sports in the last few years, but even with their strong run in basketball a few years back, the two money making programs have had major issues in keeping players in the school. When proud alum Jerry Verde up and left for Evergreen Park, that was a huge red flag in that the administration is not simply aren't understanding what it takes to have your money making programs stay relevant

 

[NazDad]

Marian Catholic has been a good to great in most of their sports in the last few years, but even with their strong run in basketball a few years back, the two money making programs have had major issues in keeping players in the school. When proud alum Jerry Verde up and left for Evergreen Park, that was a huge red flag in that the administration is not simply aren't understanding what it takes to have your money making programs stay relevant

Money making programs? Seriously? This isn't Texas.

 

[Coachbell88]

Money making programs? Seriously? This isn't Texas.

No it is not Texas, but it is simple economics, most high school sports lose money or at best break even. The "money making programs" help pay for those sports. The football gate at the schools I have coached at has helped pay for everything from softball uniforms to new wrestling mats.

 

[No Bias---Just Reality]

Ten years ago, Marian Catholic had an actual enrollment of 1,573 students and qualified for the 8A playoffs as a multiplied school. That was the year they beat HF in week one, and HF went on to be an 8A semifinalist. Last week, they lost 49-0 at home to Yorkville, a 6A/7A bubble school that is 1-1 so far and was 2-7 last year.

This year, Marian Catholic's IHSA actual enrollment stands at 1001 (which is actually last year's actual enrollment reported to the ISBE). That's a 36% enrollment decline in ten years.

Yikes!

When the "free" option in the area (Homewood-Flossmor) is now a power house, why would many of these families pay (even with financial aid) for the weaker option? I'm sure in it's hay-day Marian was probably attracting many of these students due to their football program not its academics or religious education.

 

[mc140]

If you have a large football team, a lot of them are students who would not have went their otherwise and most of those kids pay tuition.

No it is not Texas, but it is simple economics, most high school sports lose money or at best break even. The "money making programs" help pay for those sports. The football gate at the schools I have coached at has helped pay for everything from softball uniforms to new wrestling mats.

For a catholic school more football players lead to more kids enrolling and paying tuition. While the actual program its self might not make money, the extra kids enrolled because of football help the school overall.

 

[BBCHS77]

No it is not Texas, but it is simple economics, most high school sports lose money or at best break even. The "money making programs" help pay for those sports. The football gate at the schools I have coached at has helped pay for everything from softball uniforms to new wrestling mats.

If a school averages 3000 fans for 5 games, paying $5 each.. thats $75K.. is that even paying for football?

 

[drmal]

White flight, the surrounding suburbs are African-American, if you are in Indiana Andrean could be another catholic option. And Marian is a school still considered by some as not a welcoming to the change in demographics. Academically, HF is a better academic option, and Southland Prep a charter school in the area has over 500 students many who would've otherwise went to Marian opposed to the Rich Schools (Central, East, South). Marian just isn't a better option they have fewer AP courses than HF and Bloom and as many the Rich schools. Athletically, other than the girls sports, and baseball the programs are poor. Verde brought in several kids and coaches who transferred many to HF (Verde's first year the freshman team won and dominated the ESSC) he brought in talent that eventually went on to become D1 talent at HF when Verde left.

 

[sac'em]

Look at H-F's D1 players: Hall, Wright, and Griffin. All 3 were freshmen at Marian. If the school is not supporting your athletes, both academically and financially, how can they keep them in the building? Coaches have the best intentions but cannot maintain a program without institutional help. Marian should have looked into buying or leasing the old LW North building and grounds. Would have been in a better area financially and would have gotten some of the kids who would get lost in the numbers at the LW's. Maybe some unhappy PC kids and parents go there too.
I think Marian will be the next Leo. Should have moved when they had the opportunity, but will eventually wither away in the "tradition" of staying.

 

[mc140]

he brought in talent that eventually went on to become D1 talent at HF when Verde left.

His lower level assistant that left took all those kids to HF with him after Verde's first or second year.

 

[sac'em]

His lower level assistant that left took all those kids to HF with him after Verde's first or second year.

Only took Hall. Wright and Griffin left when Verde left. Buz used that Asst to get kids from Marian. The WR Ritchie came with Hall too. Is that Asst still on staff at H-F? Not that I know of.

 

[GreasyItalian]

White Flight + Bloom showing improvement + HF facilities.

Agree. The white flight is huge. Although there are still many families who have roots at Catholic Schools (Marian/Laurence/Rita/Rice, etc.) who move away to the west or southwest burbs who still send their kids to those schools. The problem is that those public school systems are good, and the property taxes are insane. Its hard to convince a family from say Tinley or Orland to send their Kid to a Private school that is 10k+ in tuition when their property taxes are also around 10k and they can send their kid to Sandburg or Andrew.

I think just about all the private schools in northwest Illinois are going to have their enrollment crushed in the next 5-10 years. Look at JCA also, not sure about their numbers compared to 10 years ago, but I think they have had a big drop also.

 

[Normdog]

If a school averages 3000 fans for 5 games, paying $5 each.. thats $75K.. is that even paying for football?

been to two Marian varsity FB games. try 400 fans per game, including visitors

 

[230football]

Agree. The white flight is huge. Although there are still many families who have roots at Catholic Schools (Marian/Laurence/Rita/Rice, etc.) who move away to the west or southwest burbs who still send their kids to those schools. The problem is that those public school systems are good, and the property taxes are insane. Its hard to convince a family from say Tinley or Orland to send their Kid to a Private school that is 10k+ in tuition when their property taxes are also around 10k and they can send their kid to Sandburg or Andrew.

I think just about all the private schools in northwest Illinois are going to have their enrollment crushed in the next 5-10 years. Look at JCA also, not sure about their numbers compared to 10 years ago, but I think they have had a big drop also.

Orland parents send lots of kids to Catholic schools and they are more than willing to pay the tuition for Catholic schools. Everyday Orland kids get on the train to Ignatius, Rita, Rice, and McCauley. Buses come into to Orland from St. Laurence, Mt. Carmel, and Benet. Parents car pool to Marist and Providence. Check the starting line-ups of some these schools and you will see Orland kids. They just are not attracted to Marian because the program has fallen so far.

 

[Coachbell88]

If a school averages 3000 fans for 5 games, paying $5 each.. thats $75K.. is that even paying for football?

Yes, between sports fees that more than cover uniform costs as well as a decent amount of equipment refurbishment football consistently contributes money to other programs. Also remember it is not just the gate totals, concessions at a football game are a gold mine for athletic programs. Low atttendance sports such as soccer or baseball can not compete with even that revenue stream, on top of the fact that they bring in no money from a gate 99% of the time.

 

[UlbKA91]

Orland parents send lots of kids to Catholic schools and they are more than willing to pay the tuition for Catholic schools. Everyday Orland kids get on the train to Ignatius, Rita, Rice, and McCauley. Buses come into to Orland from St. Laurence, Mt. Carmel, and Benet. Parents car pool to Marist and Providence. Check the starting line-ups of some these schools and you will see Orland kids. They just are not attracted to Marian because the program has fallen so far.

Marian was never really in direct competition with CCL powerhouses within the SW side Irish diaspora. It was more akin to a JCA reprenting its own "collar city", then it benefitted from the more steel mill based white then Mexican then black flight from thw far south side, those that went to Mt. Carmel, Mendel or DeSales. A lot were holdouts in the Thorns and TFs afterr those schools changed. That base went west into LW land but as much if not more into NWI Dyer and beyond.

 

[chitownace777]

Marian.Sad to see how far they've fallen.Used to have some awesome powerhouses there.I remember they tried to join Sica after the end of the Illini 8.Another thing I recall which was ironic seeing it was a private school is their address used to be 666 Ashland Avenue until it changed some years ago.I hope they can get back on track

 

[McCaravan]

They have a great baseball team! 2nd in state

 

[ScottieKnows]

Same issue as discussed in previous other posts. Why pay over $10,000 to send your kid to a private school unless there are distinct advantages? At Suburban Public schools you get a great education, outstanding facilities, and locality. No advantage to send your kid to JCA or Provo...........instead of the Lincoln Way's. No advantage to send your kid to St. Viator if you live in Barrington or Palatine. No advantage to send your kid to CoM if you live in Lake Zurich, Stevenson districts. What does Marian have to offer a student athlete over the area public schools?

 

[crazyparent82]

If you ask that question then you won't understand the answer ......so no need to explain.....

 

[ScottieKnows]

Besides Religion. Enlighten me.

 

[Normdog]

Besides Religion. Enlighten me.

1. Religon - more than "religion" its a philosophical outlook and make up of beliefs.
2. Simple choice I think my child would do better at school A than B because of #1 aligns with how I want my kid educated.
3. Ain't simply about sports first, that is just the added benefits again see #1.
4. Largest decrease in Catholic school enrollment in N. ILL is not due to increase of cost at the Catholic Schools, which there has been, its the untold multiples in increase in the parents property tax bills in ILL that make the extra cost of Catholic Schools very difficult for any parents but especially Blue collar parents.
5. As noted by CrazyParent, that you ask the question, means that you don't understand the answer for those parents (not for you, but, those parents) and never will so the entire exercise become tedious.

 

[lkhammer57]

6. There are less people in the state of Illinois, people have been moving out of the state over the past 3-4 years at a high rate, when that happens there are less potential students for these catholic schools to bring in. There is more than just sports and facilities right now, even though it does play a part of the selection process for some parents

 

[ScottieKnows]

1. Religon - more than "religion" its a philosophical outlook and make up of beliefs.
2. Simple choice I think my child would do better at school A than B because of #1 aligns with how I want my kid educated.
3. Ain't simply about sports first, that is just the added benefits again see #1.
4. Largest decrease in Catholic school enrollment in N. ILL is not due to increase of cost at the Catholic Schools, which there has been, its the untold multiples in increase in the parents property tax bills in ILL that make the extra cost of Catholic Schools very difficult for any parents but especially Blue collar parents.
5. As noted by CrazyParent, that you ask the question, means that you don't understand the answer for those parents (not for you, but, those parents) and never will so the entire exercise become tedious.

1. Agree with statement. Was involved in private schools for 12 years.
2. Agree.
3. True. In this forum....most dwell strictly on athletics, that's why I also brought up the educational piece. However....I did not bring up the spritual (values) piece. Should have.
4. Yes. Illinois brutal. Private schools decreasing enrollment....shoot the state is decreasing enrollment. An Illinoisian leaves the state permanently every 10 minutes. Public schools are decreasing enrollment as well.
5. Eh.....well then. I guess I'm not enlightened or educated enough to understand, but the original post was "what's happening to Marian". It's losing enrollment, so apparently I'm not the only one who doesn't understand the answer.

 

[CCHS-Fan]

He wants you to think Wauconda and Grant are on the same level as CCHS from student #1 to the very bottom. Don't waste your time. And then he wants to further collapse the comparison into a sports discussion. Seriously? I can speak for the girls side of things at CCHS as I only have daughters. When you make a varsity 'cut sport' at Carmel you've accomplished something. When you can compete on the girls side of the ESCC, you've now accomplished something even greater. One of the best girls sports conferences in the entire state of Illinois right there.

 

[ScottieKnows]

Simmer down now CCHS-Fan. Having a discussion on the enrollment decline at Marian. What would you attribute it to? That was the original question.

 

[Paliakas1]

Girls sports is amazing in the conference. IHSA forces Benet, Marist, and McCauley (non-conference school) through same sectional in volleyball to prevent them from all going to state.

 

[CCHS-Fan]

I have no answer. I have no assumption. And I'm tone deaf to your request, Mr.

 

[illini14]

Girls sports is amazing in the conference. IHSA forces Benet, Marist, and McCauley (non-conference school) through same sectional in volleyball to prevent them from all going to state.

I'm sure that's the only reason why.

 

[ClownBaby]

Girls sports is amazing in the conference. IHSA forces Benet, Marist, and McCauley (non-conference school) through same sectional in volleyball to prevent them from all going to state.

I find it amazing that two schools seperated by less then a mile would end up in the same sectional.

 

[Paliakas1]

I was speaking more from a Benet perspective most of their teams stay west or north for IHSA regional, sectional, and super-sectional pairings.

 

[USD24]

Girls sports is amazing in the conference. IHSA forces Benet, Marist, and McCauley (non-conference school) through same sectional in volleyball to prevent them from all going to state.

That happens in every sport. Every year people have a gripe. Baseball in the south suburbs is a prime example.

 

[mc140]

That happens in every sport. Every year people have a gripe. Baseball in the south suburbs is a prime example.

Every sport has a sectional that is convinced the IHSA is out to prevent them from advancing.