Referee shortage nationwide and some of the reasons why

[colin2229]

Been a baseball ump for 17 years.

If you quit because of the parents/coaches, shame on you. In one ear, out the other. 99% of the time you never see these people again - who cares what they say.

First thing I was ever taught was how important conflict resolution is as an umpire. A good sense of humor and communication skills go a long way.

If A parent or coach is getting out of line, simply go over to them and calmly share a few words w them. It stops it 100% of the time.

If you always have people yelling at you and the games aren’t ever enjoyable… maybe you just suck as an ump/ref.

I’ve always thought the pay was good. $60-65 for a varsity game that usually lasts 75-100 mins while being outside watching/working a HS game…pretty good to me.

 

[sporthog9er]

Been a baseball ump for 17 years.

If you quit because of the parents/coaches, shame on you. In one ear, out the other. 99% of the time you never see these people again - who cares what they

First thing I was ever taught was how important conflict resolution is as an umpire. A good sense of humor and communication skills goes a long way.

If A parent or coach is getting out of line, simply go over to them and calmly share a few words w them. It stops it 100% off the time.

If you always have people yelling at you and the games aren’t ever enjoyable… maybe you just suck as an ump/ref.

I’ve always thought the pay was good. $60-65 for a varsity game that usually lasts 75-100 mins while being outside watching/working a HS game…pretty good to me.

100% this. Bravo!

 

[forlouann]

It would not be very much of a stretch to expect $6 a gallon gas by the football season. That would be a big nut to swallow for an official, seemingly.

$ 6.00 a gallon ? How can that be ? Gas was $ 4.99 in Mokena yesterday, today $ 4.98 ! Dropping like a rock

 

[Panthers1211]

Do we know what these pay increase amounts are? Varsity levels

Football 112.00
Baseball/Softball Varsity 75.00 was 65.00
Baseball/Softball JV 72.00 was 62.00

 

[LTHSALUM76]

$ 6.00 a gallon ? How can that be ? Gas was $ 4.99 in Mokena yesterday, today $ 4.98 ! Dropping like a rock

Don't even get me started.

 

[FCHS2019]

Been a baseball ump for 17 years.

If you quit because of the parents/coaches, shame on you. In one ear, out the other. 99% of the time you never see these people again - who cares what they say.

First thing I was ever taught was how important conflict resolution is as an umpire. A good sense of humor and communication skills go a long way.

If A parent or coach is getting out of line, simply go over to them and calmly share a few words w them. It stops it 100% of the time.

If you always have people yelling at you and the games aren’t ever enjoyable… maybe you just suck as an ump/ref.

I’ve always thought the pay was good. $60-65 for a varsity game that usually lasts 75-100 mins while being outside watching/working a HS game…pretty good to me.

I don't think thats true at all, good officials get yelled at all of the time.. this past weekend I had a basketball game that went into OT, shot at the buzzer under the basket for the win in OT.. I called basketball good and all hell broke loose, 3 parents and a coach were escorted off the premises.. Human nature to doubt myself, but a parent from the other team brought a pic to me showing the ball out of the shooters hand with :01 on the clock in the background..

I have been doing games for a quite a few years and can handle it.. what happens if it was a 22 year old kid in my shoes instead??? What % of them decide to not work games again????

 

[William Foster]

If you quit because of the parents/coaches, shame on you. In one ear, out the other. 99% of the time you never see these people again - who cares what they say.

If you always have people yelling at you and the games aren’t ever enjoyable… maybe you just suck as an ump/ref.

and with that kind of wisdom, I understand why a young 20+ year old would walk away before really getting started

 

[colin2229]

I don't think thats true at all, good officials get yelled at all of the time.. this past weekend I had a basketball game that went into OT, shot at the buzzer under the basket for the win in OT.. I called basketball good and all hell broke loose, 3 parents and a coach were escorted off the premises.. Human nature to doubt myself, but a parent from the other team brought a pic to me showing the ball out of the shooters hand with :01 on the clock in the background..

I have been doing games for a quite a few years and can handle it.. what happens if it was a 22 year old kid in my shoes instead??? What % of them decide to not work games again????

Go re-read my post. I didn’t say good umpires/refs don’t get yelled at. I said it goes in one ear and out the other and that they know how to diffuse.

Case and point, I heard this story yesterday from a basketball ref. Ref makes a call that the head coach very passionately disagrees with. Coach is all over the ref. Ref goes up to coach and says “coach, you’re going to have to trust me on this one. When you watch the film tonight and if you still disagree w me I will buy you a pizza. If I’m right, you send me a pizza. First thing the next morning the ref had an email from the coach that said the ref was right and a gift card was being mailed to him.”

Humor and communication skills go a long way.

 

[colin2229]

and with that kind of wisdom, I understand why a young 20+ year old would walk away before really getting started

Please explain

 

[rocketnation]

Question for the referee/umpires: Do you see any difference in behavior by sport or grade level or is it bad and getting worse across the board?

I have no experience in officiating but have been a parent for soccer, baseball, basketball, and football. As an example in JFL football, the parents were literally 5 yards from the field, and our team had several parent ejections a year due to arguing with the referees. By high school, parents are in the stands pretty far from the field. You might hear yelling at a Freshman or JV game because almost no one is there. For a Varsity game, I‘m not sure the referees can hear much at all from the stands. Coach and player behavior is a separate issue.

For Baseball, almost all the angry behavior I’ve seen, including my own I admit, involved disagreements with the home plate umpire over balls and strikes. I think the behavior has gotten worse since I played 40 years ago. Most high school games have limited attendance, and I’m sure the umpires can hear the complaints. There have been player and coach ejections in our area this season.

 

[LakeCtyNewt]

Question for the referee/umpires: Do you see any difference in behavior by sport or grade level or is it bad and getting worse across the board?

I have no experience in officiating but have been a parent for soccer, baseball, basketball, and football. As an example in JFL football, the parents were literally 5 yards from the field, and our team had several parent ejections a year due to arguing with the referees. By high school, parents are in the stands pretty far from the field. You might hear yelling at a Freshman or JV game because almost no one is there. For a Varsity game, I‘m not sure the referees can hear much at all from the stands. Coach and player behavior is a separate issue.

For Baseball, almost all the angry behavior I’ve seen, including my own I admit, involved disagreements with the home plate umpire over balls and strikes. I think the behavior has gotten worse since I played 40 years ago. Most high school games have limited attendance, and I’m sure the umpires can hear the complaints. There have been player and coach ejections in our area this season.

Youth coaches are by far more whiney than HS coaches. I think you also know who is a good sideline guy and who isn’t. They pretty much let you know in the first few minutes

Youth parents Are bad but HS parents are brutal. So many don’t know the Tules and when you try and explain it to them it doesn’t help.

I love officiating football but honestly it’s the only sport I’ll do. Basketball and baseball officials take far more grief than us football guys so in my opinion.

 

[dieter]

I only officiate football. I think coaches have gotten better. Haven't gotten a Christmas card from one yet, but overall they have gotten better. But the fans have gotten exponentially worse. Like Newt said, football is easier, fans are farther away.

I can't tell you how many new guys just don't come back. The support system for new officials is very thin. Assigners have such a hard time filling games that there is very little they can do to protect new officials. If you are willing and able and there is any opening Friday night, you will get placed in a game that is over your head. The experience will not be good. It only takes a few of those and the new guys bolt. I try and go see as many new officials games on Saturday morning as I can, but there are very few opportunities to get constructive criticism as a new official. Film really helps but not that many teams film their freshman games and put them in HUDL. I would also say that the veteran officiating community could help more. Need more vets to give back, be a mentor, recruit a new official. We have hit a perfect storm here and not sure it will get better anytime soon.

 

[Panthers1211]

I don’t think it’s been formally announced but pay is going up in Illinois this fall. Also most conferences are moving to single games on Friday due to lack of officials. Can only think of a handful of conferences that are still doing doubles on Friday’s.

Football is getting 112 a game
Basball/Softball 75 for Var 72 for JV GAMES

 

[colin2229]

Question for the referee/umpires: Do you see any difference in behavior by sport or grade level or is it bad and getting worse across the board?

I have no experience in officiating but have been a parent for soccer, baseball, basketball, and football. As an example in JFL football, the parents were literally 5 yards from the field, and our team had several parent ejections a year due to arguing with the referees. By high school, parents are in the stands pretty far from the field. You might hear yelling at a Freshman or JV game because almost no one is there. For a Varsity game, I‘m not sure the referees can hear much at all from the stands. Coach and player behavior is a separate issue.

For Baseball, almost all the angry behavior I’ve seen, including my own I admit, involved disagreements with the home plate umpire over balls and strikes. I think the behavior has gotten worse since I played 40 years ago. Most high school games have limited attendance, and I’m sure the umpires can hear the complaints. There have been player and coach ejections in our area this season.

For from experience, I don’t think the age of the players matters. It’s the quality of the head coach. I’ve umpired 8yr old teams that had a great coach that understood the game and talked w his parents about proper expectations on how to treat umpires.

Ive had high school games where the coach is a complete clown and his parents reflect his leadership.

There’s more bad coaches in youth so you tend to have more bad parents at the youth level.

Youth parents need to understand that the refs they are going to get, are often hs/college kids just trying to earn some cash on the weekend. They are just learning the game and learning how to umpire. With that said, when you don’t have high expectations for the ump/ref, you don’t get mad at him.

The coaches that understand athletics really only get on refs for lack of hustle and not knowing the rules. They understand that of you always get on refs the refs turn a deaf ear to you and when you actually have something worthwhile to say, the ref gives you that deaf ear.

For anyone interested, I would HIGHLY recommend the book The Matheney Manifesto. It’s by Mike Matheney (former manager of the Cardinals and currently with the Royals) and he discusses the current state of youth sports. It’s fantastic and 100% dead on. For any youth coaches I would highly recommend reading it and suggesting it to your parents. It will solve most of your problems.

 

[William Foster]

Please explain

You speak from a veteran point of view. We’re talking about new officials. They’re not at that level of confidence that allows your solution. Easier to walk away.
Today’s players, parents, and coaches are the products of recent generational ‘entitlement’. What pool do you think a young prospective official comes from? Without positive reenforcement, which is all they’ve been exposed to, they lose interest. Now we don’t have to continue the process by compliments only, but constant criticism won’t be tolerated.

 

[FCHS2019]

On Monday nights I ref mens rec league basketball, the last 6 weeks I have had 3 new guys with me, they did one game and walked away.. this past week I had to do it by myself because the assigner couldn't find anyone else... So I had fun with it and missed a few calls on the opposite side and when they bitched I said maybe they shouldn't have chased away 3 young kids from the game... when they said I missed a call, my response was "no, the guys you chased away missed it"... Same thing with slow pitch, when they bitch about there being just one official, my response is maybe you guys shouldn't be douche bags..

 

[PowerI66]

Today’s players, parents, and coaches are the products of recent generational ‘entitlement

So if the multiple generations listed are the problem, it must stem from some previous generation 😁

 

[PowerI66]

For Baseball, almost all the angry behavior I’ve seen, including my own I admit, involved disagreements with the home plate umpire over balls and strikes.

All an ump here has to do is be fairly consistent and that nullifies most problems I have seen. The unfortunate disregard of the rule book is usually the main cause of disagreements

 

[colin2229]

You speak from a veteran point of view. We’re talking about new officials. They’re not at that level of confidence that allows your solution. Easier to walk away.
Today’s players, parents, and coaches are the products of recent generational ‘entitlement’. What pool do you think a young prospective official comes from? Without positive reenforcement, which is all they’ve been exposed to, they lose interest. Now we don’t have to continue the process by compliments only, but constant criticism won’t be tolerated.

Good post and solid point.

This is why it’s important for new umpires to be properly trained and have a mentor. I was mentored and trained by the Fox Valley Blues (Great Organization!!). It was very clearly explained to new umpires that you are going to be doing games that the coaches and parents will not know the rules and you are the only one at the game that has an unbiased opinion. You are going to get yelled at for the stupidest things that make no sense. Hold firm to your calls if you know your right with conviction. You will need to explain the rules at times to the coach and this will diffuse situations.

You need to build thick skin.

 

[colin2229]

Any thought to there being a ref shortage because there are so many teams/games/leagues now? There are so many travel baseball teams/club teams/AAU basketball teams/etc…

My kid doesn’t make the team so I’m going to start my own team is happening all over.

Just not enough refs to keep up with more games???

 

[PowerI66]

Great example here (sorry for the FB link)

FanDuel - Youth Umpire Goes Off On Parents | Facebook | By FanDuel | We need more umpires like this 👏 (via TikTok / hudsonanne)

130K views, 1.9K likes, 159 loves, 736 comments, 341 shares, Facebook Watch Videos from FanDuel: We need more umpires like this 👏 (via TikTok / hudsonanne)

fb.watch

 

[corey90]

Great example here (sorry for the FB link)

FanDuel - Youth Umpire Goes Off On Parents | Facebook | By FanDuel | We need more umpires like this 👏 (via TikTok / hudsonanne)

130K views, 1.9K likes, 159 loves, 736 comments, 341 shares, Facebook Watch Videos from FanDuel: We need more umpires like this 👏 (via TikTok / hudsonanne)

fb.watch

perfect example of an idiot parent arguing with an ump at a little league game. I have seen it time an again. It’s really rediciolus that a parent gets that worked up about a game that means absolutely nothing. Little Johnny will live to play another game his dad on the other hand is teaching him some poor sportsmanship. This video really makes me sick. 🤢🤮

 

[colin2229]

Great example here (sorry for the FB link)

FanDuel - Youth Umpire Goes Off On Parents | Facebook | By FanDuel | We need more umpires like this 👏 (via TikTok / hudsonanne)

130K views, 1.9K likes, 159 loves, 736 comments, 341 shares, Facebook Watch Videos from FanDuel: We need more umpires like this 👏 (via TikTok / hudsonanne)

fb.watch

Def some clowns out there.

What makes me most frustrated, is what goes on at home for the son of this dad? What life lessons are being taught on the car ride home and dinner table?

“It’s not your fault you went 0-4 Billy. That ump was blind and your coach should have you batting in the 4 spot instead of 8. I’ll always stand up for you to bad umpires.”

 

[LTHSALUM76]

perfect example of an idiot parent arguing with an ump at a little league game. I have seen it time an again. It’s really rediciolus that a parent gets that worked up about a game that means absolutely nothing. Little Johnny will live to play another game his dad on the other hand is teaching him some poor sportsmanship. This video really makes me sick. 🤢🤮

Corey, here is the issue with the parents who are problems. 100% of them are living their lives vicariously through their kids. When I coached youth baseball, I used to laugh at some dads who would come up to me and tell me they played "semi-pro" ball or said something like: "I could have gone pro, but ____." Or one of my favorites, "I had a tryout with" (fill in the blank with a pro team)
In truth, what the "tryout" was, was a cattle call in which 500 guys showed up to an open tryout. Maybe 5 of them were prospects. the other 495 were suspects.

I used to talk to my baseball buddies about it and we would laugh our asses off. Then one of them asked. "What the hell is 'semi-pro' baseball anyway? Either you are/were a professional or you were an amateur. If you got paid, you were a professional. If you didn't you were an amateur. There is no such thing as semi-pro."

These loudmouth know-nothings in the video are sickening.

 

[corey90]

Corey, here is the issue with the parents who are problems. 100% of them are living their lives vicariously through their kids. When I coached youth baseball, I used to laugh at some dads who would come up to me and tell me they played "semi-pro" ball or said something like: "I could have gone pro, but ____." Or one of my favorites, "I had a tryout with" (fill in the blank with a pro team)
In truth, what the "tryout" was, was a cattle call in which 500 guys showed up to an open tryout. Maybe 5 of them were prospects. the other 495 were suspects.

I used to talk to my baseball buddies about it and we would laugh our asses off. Then one of them asked. "What the hell is 'semi-pro' baseball anyway? Either you are/were a professional or you were an amateur. If you got paid, you were a professional. If you didn't you were an amateur. There is no such thing as semi-pro."

These loudmouth know-nothings in the video are sickening.

You nailed it! It was sick even the Mom got involved and had to add her two sense. Really disgusting 🤮

 

[i011763]

Here is an example of parents not knowing the rules from a game in the fall of 2021.

QB is under pressure and throws the ball out of bounds. Referee throws a flag for intentional grounding. One parent yells and call the referee a stupid MF, he was very loud and he didn't use MF, because he does not know the rules he was out of the box and can throw it away. Another guy tells him he's the stupid one because the ball didn't get to the line of scrimmage Head coach who's qb just dumped the ball comes up to me and says- sorry about our rule experts but at least they aren't yelling at me this time

 

[colin2229]

On Monday nights I ref mens rec league basketball, the last 6 weeks I have had 3 new guys with me, they did one game and walked away.. this past week I had to do it by myself because the assigner couldn't find anyone else... So I had fun with it and missed a few calls on the opposite side and when they bitched I said maybe they shouldn't have chased away 3 young kids from the game... when they said I missed a call, my response was "no, the guys you chased away missed it"... Same thing with slow pitch, when they bitch about there being just one official, my response is maybe you guys shouldn't be douche bags..

being a rookie ref/ump and starting out with men's league is probably the worst level to get in at.

 

[colin2229]

Here is an example of parents not knowing the rules from a game in the fall of 2021.

QB is under pressure and throws the ball out of bounds. Referee throws a flag for intentional grounding. One parent yells and call the referee a stupid MF, he was very loud and he didn't use MF, because he does not know the rules he was out of the box and can throw it away. Another guy tells him he's the stupid one because the ball didn't get to the line of scrimmage Head coach who's qb just dumped the ball comes up to me and says- sorry about our rule experts but at least they aren't yelling at me this time

What's so mind boggling to me is the lack of embarrassment coming from parents. You have no idea what the rules are and think its ok to yell out that the ref is a stupid MF. Just mind boggling.

 

[corey90]

What's so mind boggling to me is the lack of embarrassment coming from parents. You have no idea what the rules are and think its ok to yell out that the ref is a stupid MF. Just mind boggling.

And just think they are not even drinking ! Hahaha

 

[LTHSALUM76]

And just think they are not even drinking ! Hahaha

Corey:

I would probably bet they were, in fact, drinking. Which leads me to another practice I have a real problem with. People tailgating at youth and high school football games. I think it's disgusting. If you can't go to a game to watch your kid play and do so without having to get a buzz, you have a problem. Not to mention the terrible example you set.

I am not trying to virtue signal here. But these are kids you're watching, not professionals. And even so with professional sports, no one has the right to act like a complete idiot at any game.

 

[FCHS2019]

The way I am looking at is those that are sticking with it will make more money.. The slow pitch league I work for just changed pay from $20 if have a partner, $25 if solo to all games solo and paying $35.. they ask if I am ok with that, hell yeah I am, I havent had a partner yet this year and I have already worked over 100 games.. 40% increase is well deserved..

 

[corey90]

Corey:

I would probably bet they were, in fact, drinking. Which leads me to another practice I have a real problem with. People tailgating at youth and high school football games. I think it's disgusting. If you can't go to a game to watch your kid play and do so without having to get a buzz, you have a problem. Not to mention the terrible example you set.

I am not trying to virtue signal here. But these are kids you're watching, not professionals. And even so with professional sports, no one has the right to act like a complete idiot at any game.

LTHS I Agree 100%

 

[ref2]

As an official for 28 years here are my reasons we are losing officials
1 Low pay
2 Abuse, most don't bother me. But I have had times I almost said "F IT"
3 timeliness of pay, we have some schools that take 2 months to get a check from,
4 Overall treatment by the schools. Sometimes we are treated like a necessary evil

 

[dieter]

As an official for 28 years here are my reasons we are losing officials
1 Low pay
2 Abuse, most don't bother me. But I have had times I almost said "F IT"
3 timeliness of pay, we have some schools that take 2 months to get a check from,
4 Overall treatment by the schools. Sometimes we are treated like a necessary evil

32 years for me. And I agree with your list. #4 continues to baffle me.

 

[LakeCtyNewt]

32 years for me. And I agree with your list. #4 continues to baffle me.

Agree - 5th year here. Learned a lot these last few years and officials aren’t respected by coaches fans or schools. Seems the players have far greater respect for us than anyone else.

 

[godfthr53]

As an official for 28 years here are my reasons we are losing officials
1 Low pay
2 Abuse, most don't bother me. But I have had times I almost said "F IT"
3 timeliness of pay, we have some schools that take 2 months to get a check from,
4 Overall treatment by the schools. Sometimes we are treated like a necessary evil

Schools should have to front the money in the beginning of the season so guys are paid quick.

 

[LTHSALUM76]

Schools should have to front the money in the beginning of the season so guys are paid quick.

No way that will happen. People shouldn't get paid before they work. Now, if you're talking about putting it in an account to be distributed the night of the game, fine. I think they should see who is there, then write checks to each ref during the game and have someone pass them out at the conclusion of the game. It's not like they don't have the money at that time. This seems like the best way to do it. But, I guess this approach makes too much sense.

 

[stripes13]

Schools should have to front the money in the beginning of the season so guys are paid quick.

Some school’s business offices don’t work that way

 

[ignazio]

LTHS:
That's not what he's referring to, no one is asking for pre-pay. Officials have often been paid weeks, months and sometimes a year later. One school, Proviso East, is notorious for slow pay/no pay. I've been told it's because of a fued dating back to 1910.

 

[SiuCubFan8]

15 days is the latest they should be paid. I’d argue they should be paid day of.