... if you care to struggle and work at it, you’ll leave as a woman.
You came to Carmel as a girl ...
- Thread starter ignazio
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Before the rumors fly, they sent word that it is being brought up as ONLY a possibility, and are looking for feedback from Alums and Families. Which I believe are extremely against it as of right now. It’s just up for discussion!! And for the record, I’m very much against it.
Girls are trouble and just distract football players LOL.
Entertain me this. What school has “explored” this possibility where it hasn’t happened? Were you against Loyola academy or Marist or the countless other schools enjoying enormous success in this day and age going Co-Ed? 3 schools on the south side fighting for a dwindling number of boys……. One isn’t going to survive. Period! Do you want that school to be MC?
LOL @MC63 will never be able to show his face around here again.
Up for discussion? 😂😂😂😂. Good luck with that “discussion”. This move is brilliant and they’re beating Rice and Rita to the punch. It was inevitable….. All 3 will never survive being single gender….. Plain and simple. Good Move for MC!
Let’s remember….. You’re the same guy claiming Blainey Dowling was hanging up football for baseball…. It was the complete opposite as a matter of fact!
I said he was considering it a year ago, obviously he didn’t....and he didn’t give up baseball either. As far as the co-Ed I respectfully disagree. As an alum I’m against it, but it’s not my call. I don’t think they’ll get many girls wanting to come there.
Negative. It was never considered. It was the exact opposite. Coming from the same guy who said Elliot would be the starter Love ya MC caravan….. Some of your info is no good.
Ummm Rice has the largest all girls school in at least the state right next to it. There won’t be any going co-ed. Doubt a merger could ever even happen. Single sex it is, sink or swim!
😂😂😂. Rice has been sinking for a decade. Single largest enrollment decline of all 3 schools! No more Christian Brothers. Rice is drooling to merge with MMC but the Sisters of Mercy are having none of it! Fact!
This is fascinating to me. I don’t know much about the immediate situation but agree that if it is being floated, there is probably a solid chance it happens.
I also agree the move likely won’t be as successful as the Marist transition due to geography and some other factors. That said, if this results in MC becoming coed but having two thirds to three fourths of its student body being male, it will certainly shrink their IHSA stated enrollment. Would be real interesting to see if they would play in 5A and 6A then or petition up. Selfishly, would love to see them in 6A with ESL, PR, C-G, etc. That would be a fun class to watch.
I will be interested in seeing how their exploration of this possibility goes and, like you said, see how easy or difficult it would be for them to jump into the recruitment of female students. I feel like they would be swimming upstream against Marist and McCauley, but maybe that is wrong.
Their leadership certainly seems open to what some would consider wild ideas before they are forced into them.
Why would MC enrollment decline with the decision to go Co-Ed? Trust me….. My wife and I are huge believers in single gender education at the high school level. That said……. There are currently 3 boys Catholic High Schools on the southwest side offering just that……. 2 of the 3 have suffered major enrollment declines in the past 10 years. All 3 compete for the same population of dwindling boys from the area.
The thing MC has going for it….. Is a very fast changing Woodlawn Area. They have the luxury of one day not depending on neighborhoods that supply a vast majority of the kids to 3 schools. 1 of these all male schools will not survive. Kudos to MC for making the move…..
Their enrollment right now is doubled due to being all male.
if they go co-ed, their enrollment obviously likely goes up. However, it won’t catch up to their current stated IHSA enrollment (which is doubled) until they have as many girls walking through the doors as boys. And that obviously likely doesn’t happen in the first several years. So their IHSA enrollment would no longer be doubled from its current all male status so they would most assuredly see a reduction in their IHSA classification enrollment for some time. Again, simply because they are not being doubled.
now if girls swoop in and there are an even number of female applicants as there are male applicants in the first several years, then I would be wrong. But like most things, I assume it would take time to get to that level of female interest, hence the prediction of a decline in IHSA enrollment.
That’s a long way off. I’m speaking strictly as a business decision. Besides….. MC has won at the highest class multiple times. They could win today in 8A. Not a concern at all.
No doubt they have and can. I would just be curious to see the impact it would have on their natural classification. Would they drop to 6A or petition up? Perhaps 6A is a drop in prestige but with programs like ESL and PR, that could be a real fun class.
but like you said, this is all several years down the road if at all. Just fun to consider possibilities.
They could also battle JCA in 2a for baseball.
Got caught up in a carpool line for the Lab school on Tuesday while driving back down town from the "hunnits", if nothing else can be a value/values proposition choice for some of the Lab crowd.
Though I have deep sentimental feelings for having attended an all-boys high school, where a good number of the staff were clergy.
It is 2022, time moves on.
It is well known that a whole new dynamic exists within Catholic education.
Families have a lot to gain with their boys & girls being under the same roof.
The Carmelite Order has experience in sponsoring and administering co-ed High Schools: Salpointe in Tucson, Carmel Mundelein & Joliet Catholic.
Crespi in So. Cal and Mount Carmel are still all boys.
Clearly the new regime at Mount Carmel has an eye to the future and survival.
They had no qualms making big, and at the time unpopular, changes in the athletic department.
As I am not aware of a sister school to consider or with whom to negotiate, my money is on it happening sooner than many believe.
Borrowing a line from a famous movie, "It's the smart move."
It is 2022, time moves on.
It is well known that a whole new dynamic exists within Catholic education.
Families have a lot to gain with their boys & girls being under the same roof.
The Carmelite Order has experience in sponsoring and administering co-ed High Schools: Salpointe in Tucson, Carmel Mundelein & Joliet Catholic.
Crespi in So. Cal and Mount Carmel are still all boys.
Clearly the new regime at Mount Carmel has an eye to the future and survival.
They had no qualms making big, and at the time unpopular, changes in the athletic department.
As I am not aware of a sister school to consider or with whom to negotiate, my money is on it happening sooner than many believe.
Borrowing a line from a famous movie, "It's the smart move."
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Wow! I know many girls travel intra-city within the CPS system and to private schools closer to the Chicago city limits. The journey between the deeply urban MC location and the 'burbs or remote city addresses seems like it might have some different elements.
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Yes, largest enrollment decline of the 3. From largest all-boys school in the country at 1 time to still feasible single sex option, that is not currently exploring attempting to lure girls to 64th & Dante. Your numbers are obviously cooked because every year you guys claim to test more than Rice yet you’ve never had more kids in the school. Sorry, but “Stand up & cheer Girls of Carmel….” Hopefully some of the girls can play football because we’ve kind of owned you guys of late, just sayin’.
If it happened soon, it would be cannibalizing Lab and the DeLaSalle girl populations, I don't think you'd see a lot of B-MG SW side at first, they'd wait and see. Maybe some of the SE side/TFs/likely now NWI diaspora but they may be content with SES and the local IN public high they live near.
We own more rings though!! We don’t look to win games, we look to win seasons (Friday Nights Lights reference but fitting) 😉.
In all honesty though, it comes down to money. All schools are stuggling, teachers are hard to come by with the money they pay and the clergy no longer around. Rice is hurting....so is Rita....we are the last three. Rice has about 60 more kids then MC. You don’t think BR is hurting? You have been touting a new baseball field for 5 years....where is it? It took BR 10 years to fix the parking lot. I got a brother deeply involved there, I know they are struggling. This is not a done deal for MC, not even close yet, but they are going to explore it so they can use their donations towards other matters. That’s it. Not trying to cheap shot BR or SR, but we are in the same boat and you are lying if you say different. I want us all to survive so we can continue to read your late night posts on how BR is going to win without problem! 😉
The biggest surprise of this whole thread is I don't believe 1 St.Rita poster has chimed in yet 👀
De
Delivering 🥞 🥓🍳🍩 ? Though I am the product of an 80s early 90s CPS SES, I am often attributed to being a Rita grad and would have thought about had they made the Quigley move 3 years sooner.
All good points were already being made about the realities of all the situations.
What I found peculiar as a Catholic secondary ed tuition payer the last 4 years was not one email or mailer regarding how to get behind the school choice movement/debate that has taken off in many other states post covid lockdowns.
Hopefully, this thread doesn’t devolve into a school choice is great/ school choice sucks vomit train. Just pointing out there’s another way to increase the pools of students than going away from an all boys education.
But the reality for all private school leaders/orders is if Illinois Ed policy is too entrenched one way against your financial viability, then maybe it’s best to sell the land and seek greener pastures elsewher, like Citadel just did. I believe the inflationary cycle we are all in brought on by both parties (so no finger pointing vomit train please) will probably force all private school leadership teams to make these tough calls sooner rather than later.
I heard whispers. Not privy to leadership team discussions. My kid mentioned it one day after school this year. But no more info than that. And I don’t know how he knew. I could ask him later but I just assumed all private institutions were discussing these issues daily or weekly
Who would have guessed that Mendel, DLS, Hales, Marist, Laurence, Carmel and possibly Rita would go coed before Leo?
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I have never spoken against Mt Carmel going co-ed. I think it's a great idea.
I know that some of you enjoy twisting my comments on various subjects, but this is an outright falsehood.
Clown, I had thought more highly of you than this.
I really don't care one way or the other if MC goes coed, but I give them tons of credit for exploring a controversial option that would almost assuredly put the school on an even stronger footing. That is what good leadership does, even if it pisses some people off. It's much better to examine coeducation from a position of strength, as they are, instead of as a desperate measure to stop the bleeding.
For decades here on this board, I have been saying that many Catholic schools are in the process of experiencing death by a thousand cuts, and they won't realize it until they are so weak that even substantial change can't stop the bleeding. Look what happened to Seton. Same with Guerin and Holy Cross. Those schools waited too long to make the change, and now they are pushing up the daisies.
I have also been saying that all Catholic schools are going through a Darwinian process. Schools that don't adapt and evolve well will die...plain and simple. We've seen it happen time after time after time. Without timely and substantive changes, to think that things will somehow turn around on their own is burying your head in the sand.
Assuming a coed MC will happen, what will that mean for other Catholic schools in the area? How many daughters of Caravan alumni will go to MC in Woodlawn instead of enrolling at McAuley, Ignatius, DLS, Marist, Laurence, Marian Catholic, and Andrean? Will this negatively impact an already tiny SFDS? Will MC alumni on the south side and surrounding suburbs who want single gender education for their sons send their boys to Rita, Rice, or Leo...or is their connection to MC so strong that going coed won't matter? Will the net effect of a coed MC be to grow the market, or will it just distribute the existing deck of cards differently? Enquiring minds want to know!
For decades here on this board, I have been saying that many Catholic schools are in the process of experiencing death by a thousand cuts, and they won't realize it until they are so weak that even substantial change can't stop the bleeding. Look what happened to Seton. Same with Guerin and Holy Cross. Those schools waited too long to make the change, and now they are pushing up the daisies.
I have also been saying that all Catholic schools are going through a Darwinian process. Schools that don't adapt and evolve well will die...plain and simple. We've seen it happen time after time after time. Without timely and substantive changes, to think that things will somehow turn around on their own is burying your head in the sand.
Assuming a coed MC will happen, what will that mean for other Catholic schools in the area? How many daughters of Caravan alumni will go to MC in Woodlawn instead of enrolling at McAuley, Ignatius, DLS, Marist, Laurence, Marian Catholic, and Andrean? Will this negatively impact an already tiny SFDS? Will MC alumni on the south side and surrounding suburbs who want single gender education for their sons send their boys to Rita, Rice, or Leo...or is their connection to MC so strong that going coed won't matter? Will the net effect of a coed MC be to grow the market, or will it just distribute the existing deck of cards differently? Enquiring minds want to know!
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