Sandburg IHSA investigation - asst coach whistleblower on recruiting

[sporthog9er]

Pardon me if I missed this on the board already but just saw this. Wild story...asst coach doesn't like what McCallister is doing. Unethical behavior. Recruiting violations. D230 and IHSA says everything is fine....

Ex-Sandburg Coach's Claims Of Unethical Behavior Unfounded: District

District 230's internal investigation of recruiting violation claims made by an ex-Sandburg assistant coach determined no rules were broken.

patch.com

 

[jha618]

Pardon me if I missed this on the board already but just saw this. Wild story...asst coach doesn't like what McCallister is doing. Unethical behavior. Recruiting violations. D230 and IHSA says everything is fine....

Ex-Sandburg Coach's Claims Of Unethical Behavior Unfounded: District

District 230's internal investigation of recruiting violation claims made by an ex-Sandburg assistant coach determined no rules were broken.

patch.com

Sounds like sour grapes after being passed over for the HC job.

 

[SOUTHSIDECFD]

The district had to know how this guy operated at Phillips. The guy recruited right off of the rosters at MC and SR. Maybe they (230) are just sick of losing to LWE every year. Let's face it there are kids at Sandburg that belong probably at Andrew and vise a versa. There are kids at LWE that probably belong at Andrew and visa a versa. Who cares.

 

[Chicago773]

The district had to know how this guy operated at Phillips. The guy recruited right off of the rosters at MC and SR. Maybe they (230) are just sick of losing to LWE every year. Let's face it there are kids at Sandburg that belong probably at Andrew and vise a versa. There are kids at LWE that probably belong at Andrew and visa a versa. Who cares.

Recruited right off the roster? Don't these minors have guardians who have to sign off on transfers too, they can say no right? Families follow trends/coaches/rings/clout. Private to public also, so what's the issue?

 

[crazylegs777]

Oak Lawn Patch posted on the LWE loss to Loyola & the private school haters are out in full force

 

[SOUTHSIDECFD]

The coach goes and talks to a kid and says come to Phillips and you will not have to wait till you senior year you can start right away. The Academic are a little lax too. Without naming a kid lets say a kid just getting by makes the honor roll at Phillips.

The rules used to be very tough going from public to private but not the other way around.

On the other hand I haver to give him credit for working his butt off at Phillips. The CPS seems to allow one or two teams to transfer kids around to stock a team or two.

Here is a challenge to the CPS and the Chicago Park District. Put the same effort into football as you do in basketball. Start some regional youth football programs around the city. I see young kids learning football on the Morgan Park baseball fields all fall. That's the right wat to do it.

 

[juschill]

Pardon me if I missed this on the board already but just saw this. Wild story...asst coach doesn't like what McCallister is doing. Unethical behavior. Recruiting violations. D230 and IHSA says everything is fine....

Ex-Sandburg Coach's Claims Of Unethical Behavior Unfounded: District

District 230's internal investigation of recruiting violation claims made by an ex-Sandburg assistant coach determined no rules were broken.

patch.com

Sounds about right when you hire a guy from Phillips.

 

[crazylegs777]

One guy mentioned

The coach goes and talks to a kid and says come to Phillips and you will not have to wait till you senior year you can start right away. The Academic are a little lax too. Without naming a kid lets say a kid just getting by makes the honor roll at Phillips.

The rules used to be very tough going from public to private but not the other way around.

On the other hand I haver to give him credit for working his butt off at Phillips. The CPS seems to allow one or two teams to transfer kids around to stock a team or two.

Here is a challenge to the CPS and the Chicago Park District. Put the same effort into football as you do in basketball. Start some regional youth football programs around the city. I see young kids learning football on the Morgan Park baseball fields all fall. That's the right wat to do it.

The Grand Puba is too busy making excuses & keeping certain teams out of the city & state playoffs.

 

[brucealmighy]

Sounds about right when you hire a guy from Phillips.

The assistant coach’s claims don’t seem too strong. Sounds like the head coach was doing exactly what many on this board have been urging public schools to do in all these debates. He is “recruiting” Orland Park residents to attend the public school in their community. A community that has been a pipeline for many CCL schools for years and will continue to be in the future.

 

[Chicago773]

The coach goes and talks to a kid and says come to Phillips and you will not have to wait till you senior year you can start right away. The Academic are a little lax too. Without naming a kid lets say a kid just getting by makes the honor roll at Phillips.

The rules used to be very tough going from public to private but not the other way around.

On the other hand I haver to give him credit for working his butt off at Phillips. The CPS seems to allow one or two teams to transfer kids around to stock a team or two.

Here is a challenge to the CPS and the Chicago Park District. Put the same effort into football as you do in basketball. Start some regional youth football programs around the city. I see young kids learning football on the Morgan Park baseball fields all fall. That's the right wat to do it.

its alot of youth programs, private leagues, catholic league, parks, etc in Chicago. CPS elementary football programs disbanded. issue is that there are too many CPS high schools that field teams...more co-ops need, some schools don't need teams. Effort = money, non football sports aren't as expensive.

 

[eireog]

I completely missed the beatification of Carl Sandburg. Will they win the green next year?

 

[sporthog9er]

Agree to me this screams of jealousy. If coach was really only doing what it says- talking to resident Orland Park families in the youth program about coming to their already boundary high school, it's nothing. Unethical behavior? How?

 

[mc140]

This was pretty weak and obviously a pissed off former coach. You would have something if this involved Sandburg and say players from St. John Fisher. It is the town feeder program.

 

[MMA_Det]

Keep in mind that this guy also teaches at the school

This might be his “early retirement” plan

 

[brucealmighy]

I saw a post from the Orland feeder program wishing the MC QB in the championship game. Can’t blame the Sandburg coach for trying to keep that type of talent in Orland Park.

 

[RD_Watcher]

I'm very confused on what the claimed violations are. Are public school coaches not allowed to attend feeder program games? Not allowed to encourage kids that live within the school's attendance boundary to attend the public school? Not allowed to have team building exercises and lifts outside of the season?

Because if all of these are indeed violations, I will bet my mortgage the majority of IHSA schools are guilty of the same.

 

[jwarigaku]

I'm very confused on what the claimed violations are. Are public school coaches not allowed to attend feeder program games? Not allowed to encourage kids that live within the school's attendance boundary to attend the public school? Not allowed to have team building exercises and lifts outside of the season?

Because if all of these are indeed violations, I will bet my mortgage the majority of IHSA schools are guilty of the same.

So coaching staffs can go to any feeder program they want to encourage coming to their school. They can host youth camps, football jamborees etc… they can have the kids come shadow. I think all of that should be encouraged and endorsed by the head coach, the AD, and the school administration. However, a coach or staff member may not pick up the phone or attempt to contact a player from another school even through a third party to encourage them to leave their current school to transfer. All that said, if the parent of the minor picks up the phone and reaches out to a coaching staff at another school the coach should refer them to the school’s administration to discuss academic transfer.

 

[SOUTHSIDECFD]

I'm very confused on what the claimed violations are. Are public school coaches not allowed to attend feeder program games? Not allowed to encourage kids that live within the school's attendance boundary to attend the public school? Not allowed to have team building exercises and lifts outside of the season?

Because if all of these are indeed violations, I will bet my mortgage the majority of IHSA schools are guilty of the same.

There are three high schools in that district. Andrews is also in Orland Park IL. Sounds like the guy that did not get the HC job was inferring that the new HC may have been looking at kids from the other area of Orland Park. The admin didn't seem to care so it may have never got far enough to be an actual violation. Nothing to see here.

 

[johnndoe]

There are three high schools in that district. Andrews is also in Orland Park IL. Sounds like the guy that did not get the HC job was inferring that the new HC may have been looking at kids from the other area of Orland Park. The admin didn't seem to care so it may have never got far enough to be an actual violation. Nothing to see here.

Andrew HS is in Tinley Park and houses some students from TP, Orland Hills, Orland Park and Oak Forest.

 

[lweastdad]

Oak Lawn Patch posted on the LWE loss to Loyola & the private school haters are out in full force

Sounds like this post is full of Public School haters....

It's well know that the CCL has been picking off kids from the ssc and SWSC forever. Especially from programs that have a tougher time winning which means they are in an endless loop without the ability to keep their kids in district.

 

[tuccs]

Please don't let Antioch see this there are already too many circles floating around

 

[SiuCubFan8]

Please don't let Antioch see this there are already too many circles floating around

The D coordinator is great at putting a circle on a map...

 

[eagles2k3]

Oak Lawn Patch posted on the LWE loss to Loyola & the private school haters are out in full force

This is a board dominated by private school folks. I would venture to guess that you would find that a large majority of the public school people feel the same way as those private school haters.

 

[HotBeer]

its alot of youth programs, private leagues, catholic league, parks, etc in Chicago. CPS elementary football programs disbanded. issue is that there are too many CPS high schools that field teams...more co-ops need, some schools don't need teams. Effort = money, non football sports aren't as expensive.

Agreed, but I don't think co-ops are the answer - logistically a nightmare (especially when teams often don't have their own field) and in the CPS sometimes untenable with gang territories (just being real).

Way too many teams though. Focus should be on making sure the neighborhood schools have healthy numbers and viable teams. Not every dang charter school that pops up needs to field a football team. And there are too many of those anyway.

 

[crazylegs777]

This is a board dominated by private school folks. I would venture to guess that you would find that a large majority of the public school people feel the same way as those private school haters.

I love them both & think separation would be stupid

 

[crazylegs777]

Agreed, but I don't think co-ops are the answer - logistically a nightmare (especially when teams often don't have their own field) and in the CPS sometimes untenable with gang territories (just being real).

Way too many teams though. Focus should be on making sure the neighborhood schools have healthy numbers and viable teams. Not every dang charter school that pops up needs to field a football team. And there are too many of those anyway.

I mentioned about gangs years ago & you're spot on but i got banned & called a racist 🤪

 

[WIU78]

LWE folks cheering on a Mt. Carmel stud linebacker at ISU 7A game was a special moment. Both LWE and MC shared a side and they were helping out an ex Mokena Burro who would have been a LWC Knight. St. Rita had a transfer from LWE last year as a LB stud as well. You win some you lose some when it comes to Private/Publics. The greatest impact is to the public’s that don’t have decent programs to keep the homie home. See LWE Dad above.

 

[Excalibur1188]

This is a board dominated by private school folks. I would venture to guess that you would find that a large majority of the public school people feel the same way as those private school haters.

I'm a public school guy. I have no problem with the private schools. Public schools need to make their program elite to the point that kids don't want to leave. The only, I won't say unfair, but unfortunate advantage that private schools have is that a lot of these private schools have personal trainers and workout facilities that kids go to and get sold on leaving the public school for the private school, whereas you won't see a lot of public schools who have coaches that own these types of facilities, because those coaches live and breathe their own weightroom program that they are putting in place during the school day and after school. The amount of, I won't call them lies, but skewed opinions that are in place in youth football organizations and training facilities that cannot be regulated definitely makes an impact. But a good head coach gets out in front of those things over time, and then you see schools like Batavia and LWE rise to the top if you look at the last decade.

 

[eagles2k3]

I'm a public school guy. I have no problem with the private schools. Public schools need to make their program elite to the point that kids don't want to leave. The only, I won't say unfair, but unfortunate advantage that private schools have is that a lot of these private schools have personal trainers and workout facilities that kids go to and get sold on leaving the public school for the private school, whereas you won't see a lot of public schools who have coaches that own these types of facilities, because those coaches live and breathe their own weightroom program that they are putting in place during the school day and after school. The amount of, I won't call them lies, but skewed opinions that are in place in youth football organizations and training facilities that cannot be regulated definitely makes an impact. But a good head coach gets out in front of those things over time, and then you see schools like Batavia and LWE rise to the top if you look at the last decade.

I don't disagree with you on this, I went to a private school. My only question is how many public schools have been able to do that and sustain it over the last 20 years? Other than the traditional powers... I would say an elite program is almost a yearly semifinalist. That's just my opinion though.

Here are the elite public programs I can think of off the top of my head.
MS
LWE
Cary
PR
Rochester
Lena Winslow
Batavia
East Side
Glenbard West(although they've been down recently)

I think there's a lot of other schools out there who have glimpses of being elite but if the talent isn't there it's just not sustainable. I'm thinking of the Lockports, York, Wheaton Norths, Warren, Palatine had back to back semifinalists even a few years ago. These school's successes go in waves.

Of the 550 something public schools there are only 8-9 coaching staffs that can build elite programs? I don't want to get into an argument, but is it really that the other public schools aren't working hard enough as some have said? You could argue that those schools I mentioned above as elite have all the resources in the world, minus ESL. That I would agree with.

I'm not a private school hater by any means, I appreciate the tradition that goes with it. I loved seeing St. Laurence make it to state. That being said, I don't know if I buy that it's all on coaches to make their programs elite. There's a lot more to it than just outworking everyone. You need resources and above all, you need the players. If the players aren't always there it's tough to sustain being elite. Some schools have a wider net to find players.

 

[USD24]

I don't disagree with you on this, I went to a private school. My only question is how many public schools have been able to do that and sustain it over the last 20 years? Other than the traditional powers... I would say an elite program is almost a yearly semifinalist. That's just my opinion though.

Here are the elite public programs I can think of off the top of my head.
MS
LWE
Cary
PR
Rochester
Lena Winslow
Batavia
East Side
Glenbard West(although they've been down recently)

I think there's a lot of other schools out there who have glimpses of being elite but if the talent isn't there it's just not sustainable. I'm thinking of the Lockports, York, Wheaton Norths, Warren, Palatine had back to back semifinalists even a few years ago. These school's successes go in waves.

Of the 550 something public schools there are only 8-9 coaching staffs that can build elite programs? I don't want to get into an argument, but is it really that the other public schools aren't working hard enough as some have said? You could argue that those schools I mentioned above as elite have all the resources in the world, minus ESL. That I would agree with.

I'm not a private school hater by any means, I appreciate the tradition that goes with it. I loved seeing St. Laurence make it to state. That being said, I don't know if I buy that it's all on coaches to make their programs elite. There's a lot more to it than just outworking everyone. You need resources and above all, you need the players. If the players aren't always there it's tough to sustain being elite. Some schools have a wider net to find players.

How many private schools have been able to sustain it over the last 20 years? The list is shorter than the public school list. MC, JCA, LA, Naz, SHG. Are there any more that are almost yearly a semi-finalist?

 

[eagles2k3]

How many private schools have been able to sustain it over the last 20 years? The list is shorter than the public school list. MC, JCA, LA, Naz, SHG. Are there any more that are almost yearly a semi-finalist?

IC, Montini until recently. That's 8 publics and 7 privates. Almost the same. Big difference in comparison to the total numbers is all I'm saying.

 

[King MJ]

I'm very confused on what the claimed violations are. Are public school coaches not allowed to attend feeder program games? Not allowed to encourage kids that live within the school's attendance boundary to attend the public school? Not allowed to have team building exercises and lifts outside of the season?

Because if all of these are indeed violations, I will bet my mortgage the majority of IHSA schools are guilty of the same.

Are many IHSA schools, public and private, likely guilty of this? Without a doubt.

The rule is no high school coach can discuss a school's athletic program with a prospective student athlete. Same thing about private recruiting.

 

[lweastdad]

Are many IHSA schools, public and private, likely guilty of this? Without a doubt.

The rule is no high school coach can discuss a school's athletic program with a prospective student athlete. Same thing about private recruiting.

True but there are many many ways to get around this.

 

[HotBeer]

I don't disagree with you on this, I went to a private school. My only question is how many public schools have been able to do that and sustain it over the last 20 years? Other than the traditional powers... I would say an elite program is almost a yearly semifinalist. That's just my opinion though.

Here are the elite public programs I can think of off the top of my head.
MS
LWE
Cary
PR
Rochester
Lena Winslow
Batavia
East Side
Glenbard West(although they've been down recently)

I think there's a lot of other schools out there who have glimpses of being elite but if the talent isn't there it's just not sustainable. I'm thinking of the Lockports, York, Wheaton Norths, Warren, Palatine had back to back semifinalists even a few years ago. These school's successes go in waves.

Of the 550 something public schools there are only 8-9 coaching staffs that can build elite programs? I don't want to get into an argument, but is it really that the other public schools aren't working hard enough as some have said? You could argue that those schools I mentioned above as elite have all the resources in the world, minus ESL. That I would agree with.

I'm not a private school hater by any means, I appreciate the tradition that goes with it. I loved seeing St. Laurence make it to state. That being said, I don't know if I buy that it's all on coaches to make their programs elite. There's a lot more to it than just outworking everyone. You need resources and above all, you need the players. If the players aren't always there it's tough to sustain being elite. Some schools have a wider net to find players.

I would argue Maroa-Forsythe is still an elite program.

I think it's a bit silly to say "out of x schools only y are elite". By definition, elite is only the very best of the best, so we shouldn't expect it to scale with the populaiton. It is hard to win a state championship! Plus these things change over time. Stillman Valley, WWS, Geneseo etc. have all been "elite" during certain runs.

This is where I think we lose the plot a bit on this board. There is all this consternation about competitive balance with regards to the top ~20 programs in the state and state championships. Frankly that stuff doesn't really impact the core mission of high school athletics. Meanwhile there are tons of "competitive balance" issues all over the place in regular conference play. There are alot of schools who are a LONG way off from worrying about getting beaten by an "elite" program in R2 of the playoffs. Those are the schools that need dedicated coaches, involvement in the youth programs, buy-in from the school, etc. the most.

 

[HotBeer]

Are many IHSA schools, public and private, likely guilty of this? Without a doubt.

The rule is no high school coach can discuss a school's athletic program with a prospective student athlete. Same thing about private recruiting.

Is that true? That seems ridiculous. When I was in 8th grade I did a "visit day" or whatever at both a catholic and a public school. At both schools I went and talked to the football coach. I've never read the rule stated like that anywhere.

 

[epicbret]

If you "hate" public or private holistically, you are an idiot.

 

[epicbret]

How many private schools have been able to sustain it over the last 20 years? The list is shorter than the public school list. MC, JCA, LA, Naz, SHG. Are there any more that are almost yearly a semi-finalist?

Nazareth has not been successful for 20 years...

 

[King MJ]

Is that true? That seems ridiculous. When I was in 8th grade I did a "visit day" or whatever at both a catholic and a public school. At both schools I went and talked to the football coach. I've never read the rule stated like that anywhere.

Based on the rules, there can be no specific talk about an athletic program, its facilities, successes, etc. They can say "We have a team; there are tryouts in the fall".

It's an arcane rule and most schools public or private violate it. And when it gets enforced it's just arbitrary and capricious.

 

[crusader_of_90]

Camp Point too.

 

[USD24]

Based on the rules, there can be no specific talk about an athletic program, its facilities, successes, etc. They can say "We have a team; there are tryouts in the fall".

It's an arcane rule and most schools public or private violate it. And when it gets enforced it's just arbitrary and capricious.

They can talk about the program and facilities at an open house. It just has to be presented as part of everything the school has to offer and can't imply it's athletics are any better than another schools.