Q of the Week: Are we (Illinois) getting better as a football state?

[EdgyTim]

Seems like a question I've been getting asked a bit more now. So has high school football improved in this state? Have we stayed the same or gotten worse? I would love to know your thoughts on this and please provide any info and reasonings on your take on this question.

My take? In some ways I feel we have made some good progress, The overall participation numbers have continued to rise after really hitting rock bottom with the combination of concussion issues along with COVID closure. The overall level of competition I feel has also improved in general and it seems (at least to me) we are seeing more and more power programs reaching out and playing stronger competition. We no longer seem to be unwilling or afraid to play up in competition level and this coming season could be some of the better examples of programs truly wanting to play "up" than in any other time I remember.

Sure we still have alot of issues we still need to work on and improve (lack of resources in some districts/lower numbers/safety concerns) but overall in my opinion? We are ion the uupswing these days.

Let me know your take here.

 

[LakeCtyNewt]

The gap between the elite and the not so elite has gotten far bigger. In particular the biggest classes. LWE and Loyola are so much better than everyone else in 8A. N 7A the gap is a little closer but Mt Carmel is still far better than anyone else. From 5A down it’s a bit more competitive though 3A will be another coronation for Byron this fall.

1A 2A are tougher because they dont use 1-32.

Illinois will always produce great football players and athletes. But compared to the elite states for HS football, Illinois is not there.

 

[guerinfbfan]

I wonder what roster numbers look like compared to even 5 or 10 years ago.

I'd say with smaller teams today it would likely be harder to compete with those teams.

I think some individual athletes of today are possibly better, but teams in general it's hard to say.

I mean you'll get teams that are truly elite year in and year out but I don't think the number of elite teams will ever be the same.

As the population in IL continues to decline the talent pool will continue to get smaller.

 

[4Afan]

In terms of more elite players, yes. On a national level, in terms of quality of teams, no. I think Illinois is a 4th tier state nationally. Texas is it's own animal, then there's California and Florida, states like Ohio, Pennsylvania, and possibly New Jersey would be next. I would put Illinois in the group after that.

As Newt mentioned, there's just too big of a gap between the elite teams in Illinois and the rest of the teams. Illinois doesn't have quality teams top to bottom, it's 3-5 teams at the top of each class and then everyone else.

 

[McEvergreen]

It's the same teams year in and year out 1A-8A, so the gap is definitely real. Illinois because of its sheer size will always produce great players, but I personally wouldn't put them in the top 10 "football states". Top 15 maybe.

 

[Dave Brody]

I can’t speak to the 1-3A schools but the level of competition in the 4A+ is tough. Alotta really talented teams with tough schedules.

I think the players today are much more skilled than they ever have been. The pro style offenses bring out some good athletes who would normally play one non-football sport. They now come out and compete.

 

[Silver Rain]

Illinois puts out a good product. Not only Loyola, MC, and LWE, but Naz, ESL, MS, Montini, and five or six others have had extended runs as top-shelf programs. IHSA isn't perfect, but it works pretty well. How many states are as well organized? How many states have an Edgy Tim and an informed, active forum? How many have good YouTube coverage? The biggest problem is not the level of competition. (MC has had 10-year, seven-year, and six-year droughts.) The biggest problem is NFHS, despised by every state in its network.

 

[MMA_Det]

I would like to see the IHSA go back to 1-5A

I think that with 8 classes, it’s a bit watered down

 

[ClownBaby]

I would like to see the IHSA go back to 1-5A

I think that with 8 classes, it’s a bit watered down

It’s a conversation that should happen but it won’t. There are 497 teams playing 11man football this year when the IHSA went to 8 classes there were at least 20-30 more teams, I think going to 7 classes makes sense and isn’t rocking the boat too badly.

 

[crazylegs777]

Not that anybody would complain & I sure would miss it but I could go 5 years without being on this site & following Illinois High School Football. I guarantee you the same teams in each class would be there at the end with very few surprises. And also the same exact subjects being spoken about

 

[olderbytheminute]

The stars are out.
Well, they officially won't be out for another month.
But Rivals has their rankings of the nation's top prep football prospects, and in this corner of the world, it seems as though Illinois is well-represented.
23) Nathaniel Marshall, a defensive end from Fenwick (Michigan verbal commit)
29) Talyn Taylor, a wideout from Geneva (Georgia commit)
37) Christiopher Burgess Jr., a defensive end from Simeon (Notre Dame commit)
84) Jose Epenesa, a defensive end from Edwardsville (no verbal commit yet)
97) Charles Bass, a safety from East St. Louis (Missouri commit)
That's five out of the top 100 seniors to be in the nation.
If you're scoring at home, Georgia high schools had 11 players listed in the top 100, Texas 16, California 9, and Florida 19.

 

[EdgyTim]

The stars are out.
Well, they officially won't be out for another month.
But Rivals has their rankings of the nation's top prep football prospects, and in this corner of the world, it seems as though Illinois is well-represented.
23) Nathaniel Marshall, a defensive end from Fenwick (Michigan verbal commit)
29) Talyn Taylor, a wideout from Geneva (Georgia commit)
37) Christiopher Burgess Jr., a defensive end from Simeon (Notre Dame commit)
84) Jose Epenesa, a defensive end from Edwardsville (no verbal commit yet)
97) Charles Bass, a safety from East St. Louis (Missouri commit)
That's five out of the top 100 seniors to be in the nation.
If you're scoring at home, Georgia high schools had 11 players listed in the top 100, Texas 16, California 9, and Florida 19.

The next two years (2026/2027) are going to be as strong or stronger......especially the quarterbacks...my own State of Illinois class rankings will be out shortly

 

[rocketnation]

I admit this may not be the right way to evaluate the question, but I tie it quite a bit to the strength of the state's major college program (University of Illinois). The U of I has been no better than a middle of the pack team in the Big Ten for most of my life. I do like Brett Bielema, and he does try to recruit much more in-state than Lovie Smith did. However, the U of I seems to have settled into a 4-to-7-win range which makes Illinois as a football state average, made to look a little better in the Top 100 player ratings by Illinois being the 6th largest state in the country.

 

[brucealmighy]

I admit this may not be the right way to evaluate the question, but I tie it quite a bit to the strength of the state's major college program (University of Illinois). The U of I has been no better than a middle of the pack team in the Big Ten for most of my life. I do like Brett Bielema, and he does try to recruit much more in-state than Lovie Smith did. However, the U of I seems to have settled into a 4-to-7-win range which makes Illinois as a football state average, made to look a little better in the Top 100 player ratings by Illinois being the 6th largest state in the country.

Not sure how strong that tie is. California colleges have not been great lately. Cal, UCLA and Stanford have all been bad for awhile and even USC has been below their normal standards for awhile. I think the success of the state team leads to higher retention of local talent. Ohio State, Alabama and Georgia all seem to have featured star players from California. That is less likely to happen if USC was as strong as they were on the 2000s. As bad as Lovie and his staff were at coaching and recruiting locally, you have to give them credit for finding and developing out of state talent into NFL draft picks.

 

[rocketnation]

Not sure how strong that tie is. California colleges have not been great lately. Cal, UCLA and Stanford have all been bad for awhile and even USC has been below their normal standards for awhile. I think the success of the state team leads to higher retention of local talent. Ohio State, Alabama and Georgia all seem to have featured star players from California. That is less likely to happen if USC was as strong as they were on the 2000s. As bad as Lovie and his staff were at coaching and recruiting locally, you have to give them credit for finding and developing out of state talent into NFL draft picks.

It may have been stronger 30-40 years ago when teams recruited less outside of their state/region. Looking at the 5 Illinois players in the Top 100, none of the 4 commits are to the U of I and Epenesa seems unlikely.

 

[EdgyTim]

I admit this may not be the right way to evaluate the question, but I tie it quite a bit to the strength of the state's major college program (University of Illinois). The U of I has been no better than a middle of the pack team in the Big Ten for most of my life. I do like Brett Bielema, and he does try to recruit much more in-state than Lovie Smith did. However, the U of I seems to have settled into a 4-to-7-win range which makes Illinois as a football state average, made to look a little better in the Top 100 player ratings by Illinois being the 6th largest state in the country.

I really think it's time the folks in Chambana start to ask some uncomfortable questions regarding the state of the football program. The in state recruiting effort has not been good and trying and talking a big in state recruiting game is great but not landing very many Top 5-10 kids ech class......not good. And the direction the college game is going (aka spending huge money) does not help the Illini

 

[crusader_of_90]

Think about the studs who left for Texas in the class of 26/+.

 

[Dave Brody]

I admit this may not be the right way to evaluate the question, but I tie it quite a bit to the strength of the state's major college program (University of Illinois). The U of I has been no better than a middle of the pack team in the Big Ten for most of my life. I do like Brett Bielema, and he does try to recruit much more in-state than Lovie Smith did. However, the U of I seems to have settled into a 4-to-7-win range which makes Illinois as a football state average, made to look a little better in the Top 100 player ratings by Illinois being the 6th largest state in the country.

Northwestern is more of the major college program in IL over the U of I, off the top of my head

 

[brucealmighy]

I really think it's time the folks in Chambana start to ask some uncomfortable questions regarding the state of the football program. The in state recruiting effort has not been good and trying and talking a big in state recruiting game is great but not landing very many Top 5-10 kids ech class......not good. And the direction the college game is going (aka spending huge money) does not help the Illini

When is the last time Illinois consistently landed multiple players in the top 10 in the state? The 1980’s?

As far as money, they have gotten plenty on the basketball side. Lots of wealthy alumni but will the put their money into the program with no guarantee of success? Especially after the conference became more difficult with the new programs and the elimination of the Big 10 West.

 

[penlight]

Relative to top flight individual talent, we seem to be doing pretty good.

These High Schools Produced the Most NFL Players in 2023 | NFL Play Football

From Detroit to Miami, see which high schools, cities, and states produced the most NFL players on 2023 kickoff weekend rosters.

playfootball.nfl.com

 

[crusader_of_90]

Saint Louis represents!

 

[Hfbfan]

This is a great question & you guys have done a great job analyzing it. I have spent a lot of time next to Edgy the past 2+ years watching the boys in Illinois play football. I work for National Preps right now and am directly helping college coaches get necessary info on our players. After 25+ years coaching in our area and helping my own top players get to the college level, it has been fascinating being on the other side. I have gotten to know a LOT of the coaches I used to battle against much better, on a personal level, and I have been able to help a lot of colleges since I have no bias. I am trying REALLY hard to get the players in Illinois more attention. Here are my current thoughts on Edgy’s original question:
1. The top states: TX, FL, CA, OH, PA, DMV, GA/AL/LA, NC is big now too. I would say NJ is on the rise also and so is AZ. MI gets pretty heavily recruited as well as some other states/cities. We are in the next tier like a lot of you have said. We are relevant but not a must stop for every program
2. When I talk to college coaches here is what they want from Chicago: LINEMAN(especially DL right now. We are an epic run of studs the past 8-10 years). It is our longtime reputation and it helps all the other positions get a look also. I think we have also done well w/ LBs over the years. Recent years our DBs have started to deliver as well as our other skill positions. WR I would say is trending w/ kids like Carnell Tate(I know…IMG), Tyler Morris, AJ Henning, Talyn Taylor, Luther(even though he is probably claimed by St Louis 😂) as well as others.
3. QB- I am 50 years old and feel like from my childhood until now IL has always delivered QBs to the college level, but the reality is we have not completely broken through in the modern day until JJ these past 2 years. He has really helped our brand on QBs and as Edgy said- the payoff is coming in the next couple years. Having a 1st round QB pick did nothing but help us.
4. BUT…from my years talking to college coaches when I was a coach until now, the biggest challenge we face in IL and specifically Chicagoland is accessibility of our players. With almost all of our HCs full time teachers and our players having no form or spring practice formatting or athletic blocks of PE like TX does, the coaches don’t get any real look at them. HS coaches are trying to organize and Edgy keeps trying to help w/ his showcase. But NCAA rules keep FBS coaches away from all of that. We will need the IHSA to help us align with the changing landscape of college football if we want our players to get more exposure during the school year. I am trying and willing to work as a middle man between all parties involved, but in reality I am a teacher that does recruiting on the side and not sure who will listen or help.

All of these discussions you guys are having help a LOT. It keeps the message out there that we care a lot about Chicago/IL football and its future.

 

[McCaravan]

I think IL is #1 in the Midwest (IN, IA, MO, MI, MN, and WI) and, outside of maybe MO I don’t think it’s close. I would put in IL honestly in the top 15 as far as the Nation with us being in the #12/13 range with a legit argument for being #10/11.

 

[kwamizee]

I admit this may not be the right way to evaluate the question, but I tie it quite a bit to the strength of the state's major college program (University of Illinois). The U of I has been no better than a middle of the pack team in the Big Ten for most of my life. I do like Brett Bielema, and he does try to recruit much more in-state than Lovie Smith did. However, the U of I seems to have settled into a 4-to-7-win range which makes Illinois as a football state average, made to look a little better in the Top 100 player ratings by Illinois being the 6th largest state in the country.

Michigan has come to this state and recruited well. Their reward for beating out U of I to recruits has been 3 straight college football playoffs and Natty. Illinois is a top 5 or 6 HS football state.

 

[kwamizee]

I think IL is #1 in the Midwest (IN, IA, MO, MI, MN, and WI) and, outside of maybe MO I don’t think it’s close. I would put in IL honestly in the top 15 as far as the Nation with us being in the #12/13 range with a legit argument for being #10/11.

IL is top 6. Only states truly ahead of us are TX, FL, CA, GA. I think we PA v us could be a tossup depending on the year.

 

[ClownBaby]

IL is top 6. Only states truly ahead of us are TX, FL, CA, GA. I think we PA v us could be a tossup depending on the year.

Ever heard of Ohio?

 

[kwamizee]

Ever heard of Ohio?

Ohio to me is right behind us. I still think our best beats their best handily. There is recent examples too. LA v St Edwards

 

[stl705]

Great posts here. I feel like the state is underrated, but I can’t compare as I haven’t watched other states.

I look at the B1G as we’re a B1G state and the QBs on/signed with these teams:

Rutgers - Starting QB - Kaliakmanis
MSU - True Freshman /QB3 - Milivojevic (also had QB Thorne prior to transfer)
NW - QB2 Lausch and Freshman QB Gray
Michigan - QB McCarthy 1st rd pick
Minnesota - Signed DGN QB Lansu
UCLA - Signed Hersey QB Gumino
QB Jonas Williams - Oregon/OSU in final 4 with his decision coming soon.

Not bad for a 4 year period and I may be missing a QB or 2. Shame ILL hasn’t looked here for a QB, maybe woulda helped in recent years.

 

[4Afan]

Ohio to me is right behind us. I still think our best beats their best handily. There is recent examples too. LA v St Edwards

Illinois is too top heavy to be ranked as high as you have them. Our state has 3-4 elite teams per class and then there is a significant drop off. Illinois doesn't compare top to bottom with with the other states.

 

[McCaravan]

Great posts here. I feel like the state is underrated, but I can’t compare as I haven’t watched other states.

I look at the B1G as we’re a B1G state and the QBs on/signed with these teams:

Rutgers - Starting QB - Kaliakmanis
MSU - True Freshman /QB3 - Milivojevic (also had QB Thorne prior to transfer)
NW - QB2 Lausch and Freshman QB Gray
Michigan - QB McCarthy 1st rd pick
Minnesota - Signed DGN QB Lansu
UCLA - Signed Hersey QB Gumino
QB Jonas Williams - Oregon/OSU in final 4 with his decision coming soon.

Not bad for a 4 year period and I may be missing a QB or 2. Shame ILL hasn’t looked here for a QB, maybe woulda helped in recent years.

Minnesota had St. Charles North Alum Tyler Nubin drafted in the second round, he could have been a first rounder

 

[Hfbfan]

Illinois is too top heavy to be ranked as high as you have them. Our state has 3-4 elite teams per class and then there is a significant drop off. Illinois doesn't compare top to bottom with with the other states.

As I said above (sorry it was so
Long😂) I am looking at this purely through the eyes of college recruiting which may be to narrow, but we are not in the top 10. I love IL HS football. I coached it for 25 years & am on year 3 of bringing colleges to our players. But the word Top Heavy is pretty spot on. We have some great players every year AND teams. But colleges do not prioritize us as I said. The top 10 most recruited states/areas are still(not in order):
TX, CA, FL, OH, GA, PA, AL, LA, DMV(region), NC. We are somewhere b/w 10-20 based on the year. I’m the Midwest we battle w/ MI & St Louis area for attention, IN has gotten better. But we are too Dogs in Midwest. NJ, Vegas, AZ & most probably southern states like TN, OK, & MS are in our conversation year to year.

 

[corey90]

As I said above (sorry it was so
Long😂) I am looking at this purely through the eyes of college recruiting which may be to narrow, but we are not in the top 10. I love IL HS football. I coached it for 25 years & am on year 3 of bringing colleges to our players. But the word Top Heavy is pretty spot on. We have some great players every year AND teams. But colleges do not prioritize us as I said. The top 10 most recruited states/areas are still(not in order):
TX, CA, FL, OH, GA, PA, AL, LA, DMV(region), NC. We are somewhere b/w 10-20 based on the year. I’m the Midwest we battle w/ MI & St Louis area for attention, IN has gotten better. But we are too Dogs in Midwest. NJ, Vegas, AZ & most probably southern states like TN, OK, & MS are in our conversation year to year.

Spoken like someone who knows and doesn’t let the homer bias get in the way. We are very top heavy. We have the elite teams that can and will compete but the depth isn’t there. We have a serious drop off that many on this board don’t want to believe.
The guy who left out Ohio was seriously delusional. Until you experience other parts of the country and how they play. It is truly baffling to me why posters try to talk about this when they have no real knowledge about the other states.

 

[DisgustingSounds]

Agreed on Ohio football. You can’t really go off the singular LA over St. Eds result when East St. Louis has gone to Ohio and lost to a Massillon Washington school that had not won a state title in 50 some years there. It would be cool to see some cross over games between the two states pairing East St. Louis versus Cleveland Glenville, MC versus St Edward and Marion Local versus Rochester for comparison sake. Indiana football is no slouch either in the Indianapolis region.

 

[crusader_of_90]

Agreed on Ohio football. You can’t really go off the singular LA over St. Eds result when East St. Louis has gone to Ohio and lost to a Massillon Washington school that had not won a state title in 50 some years there. It would be cool to see some cross over games between the two states pairing East St. Louis versus Cleveland Glenville, MC versus St Edward and Marion Local versus Rochester for comparison sake. Indiana football is no slouch either in the Indianapolis region.

Those were not the best ESL teams.

 

[DisgustingSounds]

Those were not the best ESL teams.

That proves the point. You can’t use singular games as evidence of one state’s superiority.

If every school in this state could get their act together like Rochester then this wouldn’t be a discussion. Instead everyone wants to whine and complain about us until we bump up to the NFC North.

 

[ClownBaby]

Ohio to me is right behind us. I still think our best beats their best handily. There is recent examples too. LA v St Edwards

It was St X and they went 5-7 in Ohio that year, Cleveland St Ed’s is a totally different animal. I’m guessing you don’t really follow Ohio football.

 

[McCaravan]

It was St X and they went 5-7 in Ohio that year, Cleveland St Ed’s is a totally different animal. I’m guessing you don’t really follow Ohio football.

Is St. Ignatius in Cleveland still a power?

 

[DisgustingSounds]

Is St. Ignatius in Cleveland still a power?

Not as much as the early 2010’s. Their long time head coach retired recently so the program is under some reconstruction. St. Edward’s has been the top tier program winning the last 3 big school state titles.

 

[kwamizee]

It was St X and they went 5-7 in Ohio that year, Cleveland St Ed’s is a totally different animal. I’m guessing you don’t really follow Ohio football.

More than you know, but still think Illinois is putting out a better product. One example I'll give you is North Central's dominance in recent years. Mount Union is still strong though. I think D3 ball really where a state shows depth in football talent and Illinois has an advantage over them right, albeit slight.

 

[kwamizee]

Minnesota had St. Charles North Alum Tyler Nubin drafted in the second round, he could have been a first rounder

That kid did work against us in that Semifinal