Does Edwardsville have new visitor stands? Because in 2000, the visitor bleachers and temp bleachers were filled and two deep standing the last time I went down there for a semifinal. And your selling a multi pass to possibly stand for 8 hours?
If the PLAYOFFS started today... (Week 6)
- Thread starter Catch--22
- Start date
It was just a name I threw out there bc they have a nice facility. Could always bring in extra bleachers. Or go to Southern. Or some smaller college down there / Central IL
ESL has the biggest High School football facility south of I80.
I'm sure that others have pointed out, the seeds, and thus the brackets mean little or nothing. They are based on wins and playoff points without regard to strength of schedule.
Just one example. MVC teams regularly draw CS8 teams in the playoffs, often as the "higher" seeds. No offense to anyone, but the chance of an MVC team beating any of the top three ,(maybe top five) CS8 teams is vanishing small, records notwithstanding. They are almost all blowouts. I only pick these two conferences because I know them, I'm sure every part of the State can cite nearly identical conference mismatches from their area.
A few years back, an 8-1 SHG team drew 5-4 Providence in round one - and got murdered. The following year they went TO Providence in the semis on their way to the first of back to back undefeated State championships.
I don't claim to know how to do it any better but unless and until IHSA comes up with seeds based on actual strength rather than simply how many teams they beat, the seeds mean almost nothing.
Just one example. MVC teams regularly draw CS8 teams in the playoffs, often as the "higher" seeds. No offense to anyone, but the chance of an MVC team beating any of the top three ,(maybe top five) CS8 teams is vanishing small, records notwithstanding. They are almost all blowouts. I only pick these two conferences because I know them, I'm sure every part of the State can cite nearly identical conference mismatches from their area.
A few years back, an 8-1 SHG team drew 5-4 Providence in round one - and got murdered. The following year they went TO Providence in the semis on their way to the first of back to back undefeated State championships.
I don't claim to know how to do it any better but unless and until IHSA comes up with seeds based on actual strength rather than simply how many teams they beat, the seeds mean almost nothing.
I believe these are the most recent meeting between top 3 MVC and CS8
‘19 Rochester 56-34 Mascoutah
‘19 Rochester 42-7 Highland
-No 1A-5A team came within 14 points of that Rocket squad. Only team closer than Mascoutah was SHG
‘19 SHG 27-13 Triad
-This was very much a game in the second half
‘17 Rochester 31-14 Highland
-Closest any 1A-5A got to beating the 14-0 Rockets until the title with Morris
The CS8 is dominant, no doubt about it. But the MVC is probably the second strongest conference in 5A south and the implication that they couldn’t hang with the fourth or fifth best in the CS8 is off the mark.
Massey says Highland would be a favorite over both Rochester and Chatham, for the record.
The semifinal win against Providence was in 2008. SHG went on to beat Lemont in the 6A final. The Cyclones did not make any championship game in 2007 or 2009. Their first back to back undefeated championship teams were the Bobby Brenneisen quarterbacked-teams of 2005 and 2006. They did not go to back to back championship games undefeated again until 2013 and 2014 when Gabe Green quarterbacked them. While 2013 and 2014 are listed as undefeated teams in the record books, they did lose to Rochester on the field in 2013, but Rochester had to forfeit that game because of an IHSA rule violation. I believe the violation had something to do with the Rockets' championship rings for the 2012 season. CS8 historians the "rat" or rocketnation can perhaps shed more light on this.
Computer rankings can be subject to dispute. That is true. Inasmuch as different computer rankings will produce different results, the fact that they are not perfect cannot be denied. If perfection were possible, it would be represented by only one result. However, in my opinion it is not correct to suggest computer rankings have little or no practical value when rating teams in closed conferences, and then ranking them amongst teams from other conferences.
The formulas used by the computers are very sophisticated. The rankings will be less accurate overall when dealing with closed conferences because there are no interconference games by which to measure conference strength. That is true for the current season until such time as the playoffs begin. Nevertheless, the computer systems do measure conference strength, and do so in a reasonably accurate manner. It is done by measuring conference performance during playoffs in previous years. The results of these games are generally weighted more heavily than regular-season games because of their relative scarcity; and playoff results from more recent years are weighted more heavily than results from years further in the past. The outcome is that the best team in some closed conferences will have a considerably better ranking than the best team in other closed conferences.
As you know, the Fox Valley Conference is a closed conference. The average (mean) Massey rating of the ten teams in the Fox Valley Conference is 30.309. The Big Northern Conference is also closed. The average Massey rating of its ten teams is 7.442. This difference demonstrates the Massey computer rankings do measure conference strength.
The following example provides another demonstration. Prairie Ridge (4-1) is one of three teams currently tied for first place in the Fox Valley. South Elgin (5-0) is one of two teams tied for first in the Upstate Eight, another closed conference. When using the matchup tool, Massey has Prairie Ridge as a 17-point favorite over South Elgin on a neutral field.
Although closed conferences make the task a little bit more difficult, and the results a little bit less accurate, computer rankings can be used effectively to seed teams for playoffs even when closed conferences are involved.
“Ring Gate” came out late in the 2013 regular season but was tied to the championship rings from the 2012 season. There were a handful of 2012 players who could not afford the cost of the rings, and the Football Moms paid for them. The cost of the rings made that action a violation of IHSA rules. When discovered, the IHSA then ruled that one of the players had enough of an impact in the SHG game, the only close game of the regular season, that the game would be forfeited. Derek was also suspended for a game.
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Defensively maybe, offense I say no. Laporta was a freak and that offense was special. I think the weather really benefited Rochester in 17. In 18, JCA was a buzzsaw. One of the top teams in the state let alone 5A.
Massey may say so. But is there anybody who actually believes it? Chatham is not going to happen because they will go 6A, but Highland v. Rochester is at least within the realm of possibility
You are correct about the Ring issue. The Rocket moms got together to coordinate rings for 3 members of the team. One was a foster child, A second was a kid going thru a rough time at home as the family was struggling financially. A third had a similar issue. SHG, admirably, acknowledges the loss on their website.
The computer rankings also predicted St. Rita would beat Rochester by 2 scores in 2019. Coach Derek Leonard let off the gas in the 3rd quarter of a rain soaked 5A championship with the Rockets winning 42-7. Mostly via passing yards.
Highland outgained Rochester in that game. It was the 2 picks Rochester snagged from Highland and the 2 touchdowns Rochester threw which made the difference. Also the Rochester DBs kept LaPorta well below his per game average.
ESTL went to the championship game before he was the coach. Also Track and field (one of the main reasons for the new stadium) was super successful as well. Not sure what you are getting at with your comment.
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