DARKSIDE RANKINGS: 2017, Vol. 1
- Thread starter JCHILLTOPPERS
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i totally understand the thinking here. I struggled with marist and MS for this reason. Similarly, no issue with Gooms, knowning ND how he does, ranking ND...
... and why they lose.
exactly. I am not counting LA's loss as a loss is a loss is a loss kind of game. If this was a playoff bracket, a winner moves on and a loser goes home; however, this is a poll. So to me, a weiner loss is not a silent of the lambs' weirner loss.
simply could not find a way to fit them in.
i was not high on bronco going into the season, felt they lacked that star effect they have had in the recent past.
6. Phillips had to be in.
7. PR underimpressed with PR so far, but so what...
8. lyons is my outlier. I like their o, and specifically their QB.
9. I dont think LZ could score enough to beat marist.
10. HF is an eye test call over LZ.
I dont think LZ is a top 5 team. I think my lyons' pick is attackable, but feel comfortable with the others.
I guess i wonder if you think a full loyola beats phillips? If so, knowing what you know now of phillips - that they are very solid - would you have loyola in, lz still? phillips still?
tough calls.
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Without the LA win, Phillips CANNOT be Top 5 DSR.
Without the LA loss, coupled with their win over Amat, Ramblers sit atop DSR no question. Wins over nationally ranked teams hold sway here - just like quality losses to one (See Flyer, ESL).
It seems the collective DSR thinking is to reward the Phillips win but not penalize for the LA loss.
Does that compute, gentlemen?
Without the LA loss, coupled with their win over Amat, Ramblers sit atop DSR no question. Wins over nationally ranked teams hold sway here - just like quality losses to one (See Flyer, ESL).
It seems the collective DSR thinking is to reward the Phillips win but not penalize for the LA loss.
Does that compute, gentlemen?
It's a good question. I just don't have a feel for the Ramblers. The Amat win is very impressive, especially since they still were missing players. I still have questions about LA, though. They very well may play their way back into my rankings fairly quickly, although I do think the Blue is a bit down this year. This week's result may be the last significant test Phillips gets, including the 5A playoffs. Simeon has lost two close games to two very good teams. If Phillips wins this week, they should cruise the rest of the way, barring significant injury. I know Dean saw them in person against Richards and ranked them third. Found that interesting.
With a close loss loss to LA, Phillips a top ten team.
With a large loss to LA, Phillips not ranked.
With a close lose to LA sans wiener (holy cow, i've been spelling wiener incorrectly. I'm actually happy about that, it's like a good loss.), Phillips might be top ten. Imagine if Phillips lost to a sans wiener LA 24-21, and then LA beat Amat and Phillips Richards....you would likely see LA somewhere between 2-4 and Phillips right there...
Anything but a blow out loss to a sans wiener LA might - - - might keep Phillips in the top ten.
As godfather stated earlier, it's a what have done for me lately poll. You account for the "this week" while minding the past. I can't ignore that LA lost seven players because a wiener incident. However, what is LA now...that Amat win really helps.
That's a really nice win for the state of Illinois and I honestly don't mean to take anything away from LA, but I think many people are drastically overrating Amat. I don't see them winning many games this year.
I like Lyons also, my problem is I don't know how good the conference is this year. OPRF v HC could tell us something.
For me, Phillips win over LA was hugely impressive even sans wiener. LA has too many studs to not field a top 10 team when lacking wiener, so Phillips earned huge respect. LA with wiener looks like a world beater even though many will log into their internet when LA beats a hose-less MC team. That hose is hopefully in a safe place on the island as Irm heads his way.
LZ smells like the LZ that dominated the frozen tundra of Duchon in 2013. Sanborn looks like the mad monster that Moskal was in '13. Not looking forward to possibly facing LZ in 7A.
At the risk of getting shamed in Week 6, I am not on board yet with LT. Something screams stay away for me at LT. Sure, they may paste GW, but MS exposed GW's defense which is going through a full retool before heading to LT. HC and OPRF don't feel fully formed, so it is possible for a WSS team to run the table and still lack the cahones to do real damage in post-season. Maybe the attytude changes after seeing them in Week 6, but for now...
Give me the MLB with a chip on his shoulder over the spurned bride all day long.
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Spot on IMO. I'm really uncomfortable with the WSS right now, even if someone runs the table. That week 1 showing at Duchon threw my entire preseason analysis out the window, and the rest of it falls in line based on that.
LZ, tough as nails. they worked my Broncos last week. Hopefully wake up calls in Lombard and Glen Ellyn in week 1 and 2 will get them in line.
For me it comes down to growing a set. Running these fancy shmancy spread Os are great fun to watch, but when the weather gets cold, nothing beats a smack in the mouth to put tails between legs. LA, MC, LWE, ESL, and formerly GW all know that. LZ embodies that when not distracted.
Hopefully, GW finds the right mix on defense to find that, but been hearing too many complaints about tough practices to wonder whether it is a genetic thing with some of this crew.
Word on the street is Ramblin was so impressed by the initial DSR that it rendered him speechless. This is truly a first in DSR history.
I don't have all that much quarrel with the look of the top ten. It's still early in the season.
But, I will say this about the overall voting: There was a time when going 2-0 while beating JCA and WWS would at least get you some votes from the panel. How things have changed. Your new DSR darling, Lake Park, also beat WWS by a pretty similar score, but they did so at home while the Falcons had to get on the bus to get their win over the Tigers.
The other thing that popped out at me this week was how many of you seemed to be on the same page. Capt., for instance, voted for all the same schools that wound up in the top ten. He didn't place them the same as they wound up, but he did get all the schools right. Bones, PJJP, JCHILL, Deano, guerin, godfather, and epic gave votes for 9 of the eventual top ten. Honestly, I don't know if that is a good thing or a bad thing.
Eenie, meenie, miney, good thing.
And that brings us to newt, who wins this week's Left Off the Distribution List Award. Obviously, newt didn't get the Phillips memo. Every other panelist voted for Phillips...except newt. Heck, even gooms voted for Phillips...at #2! Further distancing himself from the pack mentality, newt felt that MC deserved not just a top ten ranking, but a #7 ranking, when no other poster saw fit to give the Caravan a single vote. This week, newt reminds me of the guy who wears jeans and a t-shirt to a funeral when everyone else is in a suit and tie.
Boy oh boy, newt, if LA beats MC and if Phillips beats Simeon tomorrow, you've got some splainin to do!
Not sure what bullet you think you have dodged. If it was your non-ranking of MS, that's not a bullet I would have shot.
Actually, I tend to agree more with your treatment of MS than everyone else's. Ranking MS #2, with no other team separating them from the team that just beat them, basically means that there are NO OTHER 2-0 teams (or maybe a certain 1-1 team) that could beat LWE or give them a closer game than did MS. At this point in the season, I don't think we have seen enough to make a call like that.
I give credit to MS for scheduling two really tough non-con games to start the season, and they did really well against both of those teams. But, the reality is that they are 1-1. I'm not so sure any 1-1 team deserves a #2 DSR ranking...ever.
I figured I'd get some heat for Lake Park, or not letting a few others in the mix. A kinder, gentler @ramblinman has emerged. The times they are a changin'.
I'm torn about Lake Park. OTOH, it's good to see a new team in the DSR. However, their margins of victory haven't been impressive, and I'm not sure their competition has been all that impressive, either. Time will tell with the Lancers. If they are still undefeated in two weeks, then I'd say they are legit.
there was more consensus this year on the teams, still the ranking of each got quite twisted. It's not an abnormally tight grouping (like the holes in the cardboard that I shoot - that is an abnormally tight grouping), but good early pick. I think the reason is: people believe in HF, LA lost, Phillips won, GW lost, MS kept it close to a team we all suppose is good in LWE; PR was presumed a top team...there was just some clear cut things this week. Shit gets muddy if Phillips or MC win...
I"m confused, can you elaborate on this a bit. What exactly are your concerns about LT? I've seen all 3 of their games and have my own concerns, just curious about yours.
It almost feels like you are making excuses for GW, HC and OPRF and are allowing for them to be allowed time to improve, but not LT. For example, they have had to almost completely reload a back 7 made up predominately of juniors -- which can take time == but they can't feel "not fully formed" and getting better heading into the playoffs. They have some really great athletes back there who just haven't played much and need time to mature. They also have some really highly ranked offensive linemen but the line just hasn't seemed to "dominate" just yet, and that unit can really take time to gel. I'm a big Iowa fan, and even as well known as Ferentz is for OL they seem to usually suck in early September and dominate in November.
Anyway, respect your posts just looking for you to elaborate.
I don't want this to sound snarky but I'm confused as to what you want explained.
GW got pasted by MS and needs to rebuild a D by the time they reach LT so they do not get DSR love.
OPRF squeaked by Simeon and hasn't looked especially impressive and tonight confirmed with loss to HC at home.
HC got pushed really hard by a Willowbrook team that may be a tough out in October but doesn't scream "quality win." The Ohio game was just crazy scheduling but looks like they are starting to form.
If it is LT you think I am short changing, fine. LT is getting more voter love than anyone in WSS so get used to how heavy that crown can be. Put up a so so win and folks roll their eyes. It's OK, I know how that feels. Shit jwar still rips me two years after I had the temerity to smugly argue Brodner's case for poy.
My point is that LT doesn't seem to be as dominant as I might have expected but that's what happens when you are the favorite. I'm sure they are playing better than GW right now but GW is not to be found in my rankings either.
I think the point is that you are saying you are skeptical of the "LT love" (even though they aren't ranked in DSR) because your feel GW "got pasted", OPRF "squeaked by..." a team and "hasn't "looked impressive". And HC getting blown out was "crazy scheduling" and they barely beat a Willowbrook team that hasn't made much noise in a weaker division , wins by a TD against an OPRF team nobody is really sure about...... but you so easily point out those teams are "just waiting to come together" or " just now gelling" . But LT starts the season rolling double digit wins against every team they face, all 8-A, the last two weeks by a combined score of 64-15 and you are questioning them. And Hinsdale South scored in the waning seconds of a blowout shutout against backups. Otherwise it's 64-8 the last two weeks against large Illinois high schools. Objectively, what's your borderline for being "impressed"?
It's fine, these are all opinions, you have yours and I have mine. But I"m not sure how you aren't comrehending my point. You are an unabashed opponent of a conference rival who lost to LT last year, and you're reasons for questioning them are spurious at best: "oh, these other teams will gel..... oh these other teams opponents are better than you think, just wait you'll see".
Edgy himself has done articles himself on a lot of the talent: Bryant who probably objectively is the best pro-style QB prospect in the state this year and both OL and DL talent that may be one like Charlie O'Connor, Emmet Cushing, Mickey Brown, Andrew Ezell, etc as well as their top receivers. If you are building a team from scratch, it's both lines and returning experienced QB first, correct?
Yes you didn't rank GW either as one obviously wouldn't after week 1, but this is just a question of what objectively you don't like with LT, it's not some LT vs. GW question. Honestly, I don't think LT has "gelled" and played nearly as well as I thought and think their best football is yet to come, but we'll see.
By the way, I"m with you on Brodnar. I've mentioned I'm a big Iowa fan and was very vocal on our boards that I wanted us to offer him. So no arguments from me there. But that same time on this board I specifically recall you questioning Ben Bryant's ability when I essentially came out of the woodwork on this board to point out that he already had a high Big Ten offer coming out of his sophomore year. I'm not sure why, but I've always sensed not just a little bias toward GW but actually against LT in your posts. Not sure the origin but I think I'm justified in feeling that way.
If you go back to the day of the LT-GW game last year you will see my effusive praise for Bryant. Pretty sure I stated his growth between Soph and Junior years was beyond impressive. Rarely has a Pro-Style QB come into his senior year with more expectations for success. I am not looking forward to Week 6 and have tremendous respect for Bryant and the program, but I might have expected them to post NN kind of numbers.
The hard part about DSR that I'm learning is that you have to make hard choices and deal with the slings and arrows of the spurned. My mistake was not providing picks for 11-15 like the others. Had I, you might have understood that I do believe LT is a top team if not quite in my Top-10. And you're gonna have to hold your belief that I am simply a guy that never throws love to conference rivals. It is one vote. Hard to draw conclusions with one data point and a sentence or two of impression.
I will see LT up close and personal in Week 6 and will give honest postgame opinions just like last year. In the meantime, LT, Barrington and Da Brook are all big scary teams that deserve some love. The comments for which you take exception were covering two weeks of a 14 game season. Hang in there.
Looking forward to your DSR rankings this week since your #6 was defeated by a now 3-0 DeKalb.
Looking forward to your DSR rankings this week since your #6 was defeated by a now 3-0 DeKalb.
Well earned on that bullet. DeKalb is my #12 this week.
@JCHILLTOPPERS I sent my DSR votes to you via PM. Let me know if you received, I'm blocked out of that email account, temporarily.
When an undefeated team beats your #6, shouldn't they be at #6 or better in the next ranking? Or at least in your top ten?
