I agree. I am saying class has nothing to do with it. If you have the momentum you can make a run regardless of class. Also if you are flat, you can lose in either class. The exit round is based on the match up and not the class of the school.
Story: Phillips will play in 7A for the next two seasons
- Thread starter EdgyTim
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I agree. I am saying class has nothing to do with it. If you have the momentum you can make a run regardless of class. Also if you are flat, you can lose in either class. The exit round is based on the match up and not the class of the school.
So why the 8a teams aren’t dominating the mixed conferences? With 8A being so much stronger, shouldn’t E’ville always win the SWC. How about LWE winning the conference when they were 7A? How about GW winning when they were 7A instead of HC? Especially if it is a huge difference right. How about the middle of the pack. Shouldn’t those teams beat the 7A teams but struggle with the 8A teams in those conferences?
How is it that LA and MS had such dominate runs in 8A but no one in 7A can have such success. WWS was the closest but not to the same Magnitude of LA and MS in 8A??
You keep making it about quality and singular teams, but that's not the argument here. The argument is the quantity of quality teams in the playoffs. According to your logic, class doesn't matter at all. If a 1A teams beats an 8a team during the regular season and that 8a team goes on to win a championship, does that suddenly mean that it's tougher to win a 1a championship than an 8a championship? Of course not. Again, the best teams in 7a are in the same conversation as the best teams in 8a, however come playoff time, the road to a championship is typically tougher in 8a because of the higher number of quality teams in those brackets. The class argument isn't really about singular teams being better, it's about how difficult it is to win a championship in typically more competitive brackets.
1A and 8A are the only classes that schools are guaranteed to be in if they are the smallest or largest 32 schools. All the rest are dependent on how those schools do. A lot of the largest school have struggled in recent years and looks similar this year with the Naperville schools and a few others in trouble. Some schools like Glenbard West have been pushed up recently because those larger schools haven’t gotten to 5 wins.
I agree why don’t they petition up to 8A? Why stop at 7A. I would love to see Phillips and ESL play in 8A.
So why does ESL "opt up" if all classes are the same?
Private school enrollment is not reflective of potential talent. This part of the post also makes no sense. No one is arguing that LWE wasn't good in 7A. You're stuck on single teams and not the class as a whole.
You're proving my point. WV was the 30 seed that year, the 7A 30 seed was DGN. Look at their schedules from that season and tell me which you would rather play if you needed to win to save your life.
More students makes it more probable you'll be able to match up. Why do you think there are classes?
I don't know. I also don't see how it matters.
I have an idea why they don't. I'd like to see them opt all the way up too. I respect that they request up at all, but I would definitely like to see them in the 8A field come playoffs.
Bones I never said all the classes were the same, I started by saying 8A and 7A were basically the same. You feel differently. You are suggesting that playing WV is more difficult than playing Bradley. I don’t agree. You saying which one I would rather play as a 30th seed based on WV being 8A and DN as 7A. Either one would be fine with me.
Based on my limited knowledge, I believe WV was in the dupage valley which put them against tough conference opponents during the regular season. I am also noting that they had a rematch against the same conference opponents in the second and quarterfinal rounds. How does this happen if 8A is so tough. Let’s look at 7A Glenbard North who beat WV and went 7-2 in the same conference. WV went to the semis while Glenbard North lost in the first round to MC. Based on your 8A theory, it’s no way the better team between GN and WV should lose first round in 7A while the other team make it to the semis in 8A right?
There are plenty of these example for both 8A and 7A which proves my point of how close they are. If I’m GN, I would have much rather played Eville and two conference opponents vs playing MC the first round.
Lastly as stated before. ESL petition up was to stay in a class they competed in once we went to an 8 class system. What would be the reason for ESL to petition to 8A? I don’t see anything attractive with 8A however I respect that we have a different opinion. I’m equally not impressed with the lower half of 8A just like I’m not impressed with the lower half of 7A.
I am not sure what you mean. What old football programs are you referring to and how are they set up to keep new teams from shining?
Catholic league teams, don’t want to schedule Phillips, Loyola was the only team to play them and they wildcats were successful.
Phillips has won multiple state championships. Sends kids to power 5 conferences. Goes deep in the playoffs every year. Always highly ranked. Seems like Phillips is shining pretty brightly.
Ok, but how is that keeping them from shining ? I don't see the correlation.
They did beat Loyola that year, but Loyola had a large number of their key starters suspended that game for posting a stupid picture on Instagram. I know it was supposed to be a two year deal but Phillips pulled out of the second game. I know two seasons ago Mount Carmel’s freshman and sophomore team, which would be this years juniors and seniors, played Phillips on the lower levels and MC won 30-0 and 38-13 respectively. I don’t know why they didn’t play on Varsity, that was during Frank Lenti’s era, but I’d like to see this game scheduled every year.
Honestly you hit everything on the head with your response, Loyola was shorthanded that night and it showed at times but it is still a Class 8A team and arguably the best program in the state of Illinois over the last few years.
Phillips defense was solid making sure the Ramblers didn’t score on the goal line. Hopefully in the future we get those matches.
I know others have said this already but here we go again. Your missing the point. You keep talking one game. If ESL was playing in 8A every week and then the gauntlet in the 8A playoffs we’ll the road wouldn’t be the same. IMO ESL defense is very suspect. Giving up 48 points earned us the right to question them. I will tell you none of the top 8A teams will allow ESL to score 50 points.
Honestly, I can still see ESL possibly scoring 50 points against a top 8a team, but perhaps losing in what is essentially a shootout.
ESL is 5A so what do they have to do with this? The topic and question is about 8A and 7A being the same. I feel they are and Bones feel 8A is tougher. ESL is 5A and has no skin in the game.
Now to address your point, the same BS was said when Naz won 5A. Bones was one that said the play off grind of 7A would be too much for the 5A Naz. 2018 results answer that question for you.
Now your passion to discredit ESL on every post is becoming suspect. There are very few 8A only conferences in the state of Illinois so your point isn’t valid. By the way I believe the SWC has a winning record against the SWSB conference so I’m sorry if I’m not impressed. Even still I don’t go around trying to discredit a team based on one game results? Even when they aren’t the topic.
Good luck the rest of the season.
I think corey’s problem is he is stuck on LWE ( For which he should be ) and doesn’ t like any other team to be talked about if the talk is not LWE....Every post he refers back to ESL... Dude let everyone else topic shine ESL will play it one game at a time. There is no topic without you jumping in bringing up ESL. Move on
Pretty sure. That was a couple years ago and I am sure it’s archived somewhere. I could be wrong but that is how I remember it for some reason.
I don't recall that. I have friends and acquaintances that have coached and do coach at Naz. It is very likely that I said I wouldn't rank them above them without playing them. I have definitely requested that they prove it against the likes of a Simeon or HF.
Also, enrollment of open enrollment schools means nothing, or closed boundried schools that operate like open boundried schools.
Yes, I didn't think it was anything more than the current argument that 8A is more difficult simply because of the school size. It never came across as a dislike for Naz. In the end, it's not that important. I understand you point.
I’ve mentioned it before and would still love to see 8A as the true state champion. Open to the first 32 teams that opt in. The rest can be bracketed the way they always are but 8A is the open division with a title of State Champion.
HELL YES!!
I would love to see a 32 team bracket system. And like the guy said above, the winner will be crowned state champion.
But the way Illinois is set up, they wouldn’t go for it
I would love to see a 32 team bracket system. And like the guy said above, the winner will be crowned state champion.
But the way Illinois is set up, they wouldn’t go for it
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