Ref Staffing Issues

[LTHSALUM76]

Not really, I knew you’d respond to it showing it’s not easy to just let ignorant comments(which that was, I usually appreciate your commentary) directed your way just slide.

1. Just because you pay to sit in an event does not then make you entitled to rant and rave and insult the officials. And if you are ignorant enough to do so, then they’re supposed to just take it because they chose that advocation?
2. Officials shouldn’t really engage with fans I agree, but it takes awhile to get to the point where you hear fans but don’t listen. The root of this officials shortage isn’t because 15+ yr officials like myself have thin skin, it’s the 1-5yr officials who haven’t yet acquired the ability to not be effected by the harassment. It’s easy to not hear you fools in a varsity game, but a gym or back field with 20 fans and no ambient noise, you can hear every ignorant comment rooted in a) not knowing the rules
b) not understanding officiating philosophy
c) fans having inherent bias for your team
d) not being mature enough to realize people make mistakes
e) parents being so monetarily and time invested in their kid getting a scholarship or winning at all costs they become irrational.
The people that work those back gyms and freshman fields are often the new officials, who like anyone starting a new role, don’t have the experience to live up to the unrealistic standard that some of you have. So for 2hrs they hear people like yourself who think officials should be robots and somehow not hear you shouting at them. Add in that it is really hard to be good at this craft, especially in lower levels because the play isn’t clean, and they get fed up and quit.

At the end of the day officials are people. They have emotions, they have the ability to hear, they have your same life stresses. It’s natural they reach a breaking point. To put it on an official for engaging an ignorant fan is just blaming the victim. High school sports are an activity, shut up and enjoy watching kids grow and learn. To have the stance that someone who makes less than $20/hour should have to be subject to harassment because they wear stripes is ridiculous. You want to cry your lungs out at college and pro refs who are well compensated, by all means. They can’t hear you anyways, and when we do it has 0 effect. Plus it’s funny, to some of us, to hear a 50yr old man nearly stroke out over holding for 3hrs. But you need to lower your expectations and change your perspective for the high school folks or there won’t be many left soon.

No they really shouldn’t engage, but they shouldn’t even have to engage with the “adults” who attend these events.

This is a good post. And I agree with pretty much of all of it. I guess the point I was trying to make is this. If an official does engage, does it, in most cases, de-escalate the situation or escalate it? I know every situation is a little different. And I have said many times, being an official is not an easy job. You have fans and coaches on one side who want to beat the other side. They might even dislike each other. BUT, no one seems to like the officials on either side. The only "friends" they have are each other.

No one should put up with abuse. And I guarantee many officials go home after the game and say to themselves, "what the F** am I doing this for?" I get that.

And I am totally on board with the horrible behavior you describe of some "adults" at games...women too sometimes. It is disgusting. Some of the parents we had at my son's football
games at Lockport were embarrassing. Especially when he was a junior. The parents of senior kids that year were ridiculous. Women too. One guy would constantly yell at Bret Kooi the whole game regarding the play calling. There was no way Kooi couldn't hear it. Not only did Kooi not say anything...he didn't even turn around. Of course the guy screamed at refs too. Just obnoxious.

I don't know what can be done. Maybe you just have security kick them out of the games. But, like you said, the lower level games don't have security and fans are generally closer to the field. I have heard of refs/umps threatening the team with the abusers saying, if the coaches, school officials don't help to take care of it, said team would forfeit. I saw more than one parent get kicked out of football, softball and baseball games when my kids played there. Lockport parents too.

I would guess it's the newer guys who don't want to put up with it like you say. In years past I asked both of my sons what they thought of maybe umpiring or being a ref of football as a part time gig. In the blink of an eye they both emphatically said NO! And they both said there was no way they would put up with the crap refs deal with. They both played baseball and football so you know they were hearing all the shit said by adults when they were on the field.

Maybe they should just outlaw tailgating before games. I would think schools actually do. Because there is no doubt in my mind many if not most of these idiots are at lease a little liquored up. But, there are people who might have a beer or two who never cause trouble and are there to watch the game and have a good time. So, you really can't blame the liquor. Honestly, I think it's a horrible decision to tailgate before high school football games. That is an argument for another time.

 

[PowerI66]

What some of you want to see

 

[Chief321]

This is a good post. And I agree with pretty much of all of it. I guess the point I was trying to make is this. If an official does engage, does it, in most cases, de-escalate the situation or escalate it? I know every situation is a little different. And I have said many times, being an official is not an easy job. You have fans and coaches on one side who want to beat the other side. They might even dislike each other. BUT, no one seems to like the officials on either side. The only "friends" they have are each other.

No one should put up with abuse. And I guarantee many officials go home after the game and say to themselves, "what the F** am I doing this for?" I get that.

And I am totally on board with the horrible behavior you describe of some "adults" at games...women too sometimes. It is disgusting. Some of the parents we had at my son's football
games at Lockport were embarrassing. Especially when he was a junior. The parents of senior kids that year were ridiculous. Women too. One guy would constantly yell at Bret Kooi the whole game regarding the play calling. There was no way Kooi couldn't hear it. Not only did Kooi not say anything...he didn't even turn around. Of course the guy screamed at refs too. Just obnoxious.

I don't know what can be done. Maybe you just have security kick them out of the games. But, like you said, the lower level games don't have security and fans are generally closer to the field. I have heard of refs/umps threatening the team with the abusers saying, if the coaches, school officials don't help to take care of it, said team would forfeit. I saw more than one parent get kicked out of football, softball and baseball games when my kids played there. Lockport parents too.

I would guess it's the newer guys who don't want to put up with it like you say. In years past I asked both of my sons what they thought of maybe umpiring or being a ref of football as a part time gig. In the blink of an eye they both emphatically said NO! And they both said there was no way they would put up with the crap refs deal with. They both played baseball and football so you know they were hearing all the shit said by adults when they were on the field.

Maybe they should just outlaw tailgating before games. I would think schools actually do. Because there is no doubt in my mind many if not most of these idiots are at lease a little liquored up. But, there are people who might have a beer or two who never cause trouble and are there to watch the game and have a good time. So, you really can't blame the liquor. Honestly, I think it's a horrible decision to tailgate before high school football games. That is an argument for another time.

You’re right, if you don’t engage a problem fan in the right way it’s just going to escalate the situation. It really should be 100% on game management and not the officials, or coaches. Our role is to make sure the players and the game are getting our attention. Unfortunately most times the ADs don’t have the guts to do something about it and everyone suffers. If a fan is bad enough that they need to be gone I do not engage them, I get game management. Like you said, from the jump the fans don’t like me so if I go to throw one of them out I’m shaking the bee hive, plus I don’t get paid for that crap. The worst cases are youth and underclass games where there is rarely any authority so it lands on young officials and we’re starting to feel those effects. End of the day, people need to be better.

 

[cornerrat]

This is a good post. And I agree with pretty much of all of it. I guess the point I was trying to make is this. If an official does engage, does it, in most cases, de-escalate the situation or escalate it? I know every situation is a little different. And I have said many times, being an official is not an easy job. You have fans and coaches on one side who want to beat the other side. They might even dislike each other. BUT, no one seems to like the officials on either side. The only "friends" they have are each other.

No one should put up with abuse. And I guarantee many officials go home after the game and say to themselves, "what the F** am I doing this for?" I get that.

And I am totally on board with the horrible behavior you describe of some "adults" at games...women too sometimes. It is disgusting. Some of the parents we had at my son's football
games at Lockport were embarrassing. Especially when he was a junior. The parents of senior kids that year were ridiculous. Women too. One guy would constantly yell at Bret Kooi the whole game regarding the play calling. There was no way Kooi couldn't hear it. Not only did Kooi not say anything...he didn't even turn around. Of course the guy screamed at refs too. Just obnoxious.

I don't know what can be done. Maybe you just have security kick them out of the games. But, like you said, the lower level games don't have security and fans are generally closer to the field. I have heard of refs/umps threatening the team with the abusers saying, if the coaches, school officials don't help to take care of it, said team would forfeit. I saw more than one parent get kicked out of football, softball and baseball games when my kids played there. Lockport parents too.

I would guess it's the newer guys who don't want to put up with it like you say. In years past I asked both of my sons what they thought of maybe umpiring or being a ref of football as a part time gig. In the blink of an eye they both emphatically said NO! And they both said there was no way they would put up with the crap refs deal with. They both played baseball and football so you know they were hearing all the shit said by adults when they were on the field.

Maybe they should just outlaw tailgating before games. I would think schools actually do. Because there is no doubt in my mind many if not most of these idiots are at lease a little liquored up. But, there are people who might have a beer or two who never cause trouble and are there to watch the game and have a good time. So, you really can't blame the liquor. Honestly, I think it's a horrible decision to tailgate before high school football games. That is an argument for another time.

All.... Now is as good as time as any. Other then your reference to alcohol (for those that do that and shouldn't) which can be a factor on occasion with a fan getting yappy. Why is it a horrible decision to tailgate? Just curious. Ratsy

 

[LTHSALUM76]

All.... Now is as good as time as any. Other then your reference to alcohol (for those that do that and shouldn't) which can be a factor on occasion with a fan getting yappy. Why is it a horrible decision to tailgate? Just curious. Ratsy

Tailgating, in an of itself, is fine with me as long as it's done in the proper place while attending the proper event. Tailgating doesn't belong anywhere near HS grounds or games, period. I have to question what message a parent is sending when they are getting pissed up (some of them) before a HS football game. If you want to cook something before the game, have at it.

I just don't think alcohol belongs anywhere near a HS game and any adult who drinks and gets their buzz on before a game should be ashamed of themselves. But these are people with no shame, so there's that. And let's not forget, some of these people get behind the wheel of a car. Kids aren't stupid. They see that behavior and normalize it. Parents are supposed to be setting examples. And they are, one way or another.

And I will go even further. Any adult caught with alcohol on school grounds should be arrested on the spot. They should know better.

I hope I satisfied your curiosity and thank you for asking.

 

[cornerrat]

All.... So just for clarity sans the alcohol and the fellowship of a group of friends breaking of bread before a game and talking football on school grounds is a go. Got it. Ratsy

 

[cornerrat]

All.... From the Ihsa. Ratsy

IHSA Announces Partnership With Officially Human

The Illinois High School Association (IHSA) is proud to announce a new partnership with Officially Human, an organization whose mission is to “restore respect to game officials and recognize them as authorities on the fields and courts.” “We are excited to be partnering with Officially Human,”...

www.ihsa.org

 

[stripes13]

I'm A.I.

 

[ignazio]

It’s a great side gig - especially if you’re downstate because you have a great chance of doing a state final.

 

[johnndoe]

Not sure if this is related to ref staffing issues but all games, in Week 9 (except for one) across both divisions of the South Suburban Conference are Thursday night affairs.

 

[shep99]

Not sure if this is related to ref staffing issues but all games, in Week 9 (except for one) across both divisions of the South Suburban Conference are Thursday night affairs.

It is. We did the same thing last year week 9.

 

[FakeMontana]

They are humans…

I probably reffed 30 football games per year and 70-80 hoops games from 1995-2010 before my knees started giving me trouble.

The number one thing you are taught as a ref is never to engage with a fan, especially in lower level games where fans are often on the sidelines.

What surprises me about the refs I've seen in past 5 years is the amount of refs who will start screaming back or trying to rationalize calls to fans. This encourages even more bad fan behavior.