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Inexplicable.

E

ESCC fan

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Nov 15, 2003
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Game tied 14-14. Marist in the red zone but shooting themselves in the foot w/ penalties. First a TD gets called back for holding. Then another hold on 3rd down should make it 3rd and goal from the 18. Instead, ND declines that penalty. Marist kicks a 25 yard FG w/ 35 secs left to win.

WHY decline that penalty? WHY?
 
I thought the same thing.

Marist was going to run a play IF it was 3rd & 18 and run as much clock down before taking a TO.

Giving them a shorter FG attempt made no sense.
 
Can't wait to hear what Gooms has to say about this. I said it earlier in the week theres just some guys that always get outcoached
 
It's too bad to see a team like ND leave in first round against a conference opponent. I'm sure there are other bad first round games but geez. 2 teams that played a couple weeks ago? Marist had good last couple weeks / tests against benet Jc and naz. That's a tough 6&4 team.
 
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happy to bust your like cherry spr...could not agree more.

meanwhile in 7a...
Blue Island (Eisenhower) 32 F
Machesney Park (Harlem) 13
 
I'm not sure what the rationale was for declining the penalty. I'd have taken it for two reasons: stoping the clock (ND was out of timeouts) because the penalized play was a run play and to push them back farther. Marist lined up the fourth down play and barked signals to draw ND off then ran the play clock down and called a timeout. My only thought was maybe ND was trying to force the kick from the right hash. The touchdown that was called back prior to the play in question was a jet sweep where I know Marist was of course trying to score but also trying to get to the other hash mark had they not.

An ugly incident at halftime by Marist rushing the to the other side of the field to taunt ND as they were headed to the locker room . A skirmish occurred involving basically the whole Marist team and a few ND players and coaches. Marist did the same thing in the first game at halftime and after the game with the taunting. Since it's happened twice I'm assuming it's encouraged and condoned by the coaching staff. Tonight they walked off after the game with some class but only after a meeting at midfield involving the referees and the two coaching staffs before the second half began.

Lastly, I know this is going to sound like sour grapes but the officiating in both Marist/ND games was terrible. Tonight being worse than the first matchup. There was an obvious pick play on the first Marist touchdown. A Marist fumble recovered by ND on the winning field goal drive that was I'm assuming whistled dead. No one on the field seemed to hear it because the runner was still upright and fighting for yardage and the ND players tackling and trying to strip the ball. Numerous stoppages of play to figure out the clock . Numerous conferences between the referees amongst themselves and conferences with the coaches. Referees being completely absent from the skirmish at the half. My apologies to all of the fine referees out there but I really think the state of officiating at the high school level is at an all time low. Not just because of this game but seemingly more and more games anymore.
 
Just saw the replay and went straight to that play. I'm actually incredulous. He did decline the penalty. My only rationale is he would have left himself less time on the clock had the kick gone through but not giving your defense one more chance to do something is just amazing to me. This is why I previously said I had no faith in this coaching staff. For stuff like this.
 
As for the fumble that wasn't, there's 3 ND guys tackling the Marist WR. Marist WR is going nowhere and fast. That is forward progress stopped. I'm not even sure the linesman even saw the ball pop out but in my opinion the linesman is right (ref2, zebra, it's the 2 hr 22 or 2 hr 223 mark on High school cube assuming the game stays up. I want your opinion on this.).
 
Being a Marist alum and fan I'm glad he declined the penalty..I'm sure he was thinking of trying to save a few seconds by not giving Marist another 3rd down play to run clock...but at that point he should have been playing to give Marist the longer field goal and try for ot, considering the try for the 8 seemed to barely go thru one from around the 18, depending on what happened if they replayed the 3rd down again would have been nothing more than a coin flip in my opinion.
That being said I think it stinks that 2 ESCC teams had to meet in first round, it was gonna hurt for either losing team...glad my RedHawks were able to sneak one out.
 
eireog said:
I'm not sure what the rationale was for declining the penalty. I'd have taken it for two reasons: stoping the clock (ND was out of timeouts) because the penalized play was a run play and to push them back farther. Marist lined up the fourth down play and barked signals to draw ND off then ran the play clock down and called a timeout. My only thought was maybe ND was trying to force the kick from the right hash. The touchdown that was called back prior to the play in question was a jet sweep where I know Marist was of course trying to score but also trying to get to the other hash mark had they not.

An ugly incident at halftime by Marist rushing the to the other side of the field to taunt ND as they were headed to the locker room . A skirmish occurred involving basically the whole Marist team and a few ND players and coaches. Marist did the same thing in the first game at halftime and after the game with the taunting. Since it's happened twice I'm assuming it's encouraged and condoned by the coaching staff. Tonight they walked off after the game with some class but only after a meeting at midfield involving the referees and the two coaching staffs before the second half began.

Lastly, I know this is going to sound like sour grapes but the officiating in both Marist/ND games was terrible. Tonight being worse than the first matchup. There was an obvious pick play on the first Marist touchdown. A Marist fumble recovered by ND on the winning field goal drive that was I'm assuming whistled dead. No one on the field seemed to hear it because the runner was still upright and fighting for yardage and the ND players tackling and trying to strip the ball. Numerous stoppages of play to figure out the clock . Numerous conferences between the referees amongst themselves and conferences with the coaches. Referees being completely absent from the skirmish at the half. My apologies to all of the fine referees out there but I really think the state of officiating at the high school level is at an all time low. Not just because of this game but seemingly more and more games anymore.
Click to expand...

Eirog, what sounds sour is you making a statement that Marist coaches condone "taunting". Please. That does not happen under Dunne. Good season Dons, and again, too bad escc had a round 1 matchup
 
spr8484 said:
Eirog, what sounds sour is you making a statement that Marist coaches condone "taunting". Please. That does not happen under Dunne. Good season Dons, and again, too bad escc had a round 1 matchup
Click to expand...
That doesn't happen twice if it weren't condoned and I'm assuming only stopped after the coaches put a stop to it.
 
eireog said:
That doesn't happen twice if it weren't condoned and I'm assuming only stopped after the coaches put a stop to it.
Click to expand...

So the coaches condone taunting but then you say in this response that they put a stop to it? Confused....
 
spr8484 said:
So the coaches condone taunting but then you say in this response that they put a stop to it? Confused....
Click to expand...
Exactly as I said it. Marist did the same low brow crap in game one before during and after that game . They did the same stuff last night that could have turned uglier had it not been for ND coaches, staff and security turning back most of the ND players , whom had already left the stadium for the locker room. The second half began after a conference at midfield involving the coaches and referees . I'm assuming that as a result of that conference Marist addressed the issue and a much different Marist team left the stadium with some class which was in stark contrast to their behavior after all of game one and half of last nights game.
 
eireog said:
Exactly as I said it. Marist did the same low brow crap in game one before during and after that game . They did the same stuff last night that could have turned uglier had it not been for ND coaches, staff and security turning back most of the ND players , whom had already left the stadium for the locker room. The second half began after a conference at midfield involving the coaches and referees . I'm assuming that as a result of that conference Marist addressed the issue and a much different Marist team left the stadium with some class which was in stark contrast to their behavior after all of game one and half of last nights game.
Click to expand...
Ok eireog. Before you classify a program as "low brow" maybe look in your own stands.

"Emotions were high throughout the game on both sides. The teams are East Suburban Catholic conference foes and take the North Side vs. South Side thing pretty seriously. There was a non-violent skirmish between the teams right before halftime that resulted in a spectator on the Notre Dame sideline being ejected from the game."

http://suntimeshighschoolsports.com...-gillens-clutch-kick-leads-marist-notre-dame/
 
I hold representatives of the school to a higher level of responsibility than the fans. If you choose to ignore the Marist staffs role in all of this it's certainly your perogative.
 
Just curious as I was not there......how do we know who or what started it....and also if no one on ND was doing any "low brow crap" than there would be no skirmish....seems to me it takes two to tango?
 
goomsback said:
Just saw the replay and went straight to that play. I'm actually incredulous. He did decline the penalty. My only rationale is he would have left himself less time on the clock had the kick gone through but not giving your defense one more chance to do something is just amazing to me. This is why I previously said I had no faith in this coaching staff. For stuff like this.
Click to expand...
They can't quote silence.
 
Regarding the scuffle, I will just say that I don't think I've ever seen that scenario play out at ND before. But it happened twice against Marist this year. Take that as you will.
 
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epicbret said:
Anytime. If "lol Dons" hurt your sensitive nature, I figured I might as well say what I was thinking
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It doesn't hurt me at all to the contrary I just think it shows your lack of class laughing at a high school losing a football game. You go on to prove your lack of any semblance of class by telling me to "grow a pair".

My last statement on the issues in this thread is to wish Marist good luck as a representative of the ESCC. I believe Marist can make a good run in 8A as I had hoped ND would've had they gotten past Marist. Just wasn't meant to be though. I wish all of the ESCC teams success the rest of the way Naz included.
 
I'm pretty sure you can blame your own golden domer TandM for the lol
 
I'm laughing at the Coaches. They're big boys. And Tandm...

I feel bad for the players, but they can rest assured there are worse things in the world that losing to a lesser seed. Damn Grant...
 
Was it a fan thrown out or a lower level coach? ND fans are saying it was a coach. Sadly it's not the first time I know of at least two incidents a few years ago of visiting teams trying to get on/off the field. But the bigger shame is the IHSA putting conference rivals against each other in the first round. And hey you ND guys take your bickering elsewhere.
 
Give me a break "Eirorg".

The fact that ND fans would complain about the officiating is ridiculous. Marist had two touchdowns called back for penalties. And that roughing the punter penalty in the 4th quarter was nothing short of a gift and total theatrics by the punter (not his fault, I'd have done it too, but the flag was a joke). Blame your poor coaching for the loss.

As for the halftime spectacle, ND fans need to take a look in the mirror this week. I have a brother on Marist, who told my family that not only did ND players initiate the taunting, but the jeering coming from the ND stands and walkway to the locker room was obscene. There were 50+ year old men yelling expletives and giving Marist kids the finger. Grow up.

Pat Dunne is the classiest coach in the conference hands down and everyone knows it, and he would never tolerate any nonsense like that coming from our players/fans. Tough loss for you guys and unfortunate the IHSA has a clear bias against the private schools, but don't point the finger at the refs or our coaches.
 
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ESCC Alum said:
Give me a break "Eirorg".

The fact that ND fans would complain about the officiating is ridiculous. Marist had two touchdowns called back for penalties. And that roughing the punter penalty in the 4th quarter was nothing short of a gift and total theatrics by the punter (not his fault, I'd have done it too, but the flag was a joke). Blame your poor coaching for the loss.

As for the halftime spectacle, ND fans need to take a look in the mirror this week. I have a brother on Marist, who told my family that not only did ND players initiate the taunting, but the jeering coming from the ND stands and walkway to the locker room was obscene. There were 50+ year old men yelling expletives and giving Marist kids the finger. Grow up.

Pat Dunne is the classiest coach in the conference hands down and everyone knows it, and he would never tolerate any nonsense like that coming from our players/fans. Tough loss for you guys and unfortunate the IHSA has a clear bias against the private schools, but don't point the finger at the refs or our coaches.
Click to expand...

ESCC alum,

I fully intended to make my last statement my last statement but I do want to address what you've said about the obscenities hurled at the Marist players. I was too far from the walkway from the field to the locker room so I can't confirm or deny that this happened. I will say that if this is true that it's completely unacceptable and classless. If it is true I apologize to your brother and family and all the Marist players and families for ignorant behavior that I would hope was an isolated idiot in the crowd.
 
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