#67 in the nation. Is IL that terrible for talent?
https://www.maxpreps.com/news/kBJ0M...season-top-100-high-school-football-teams.htm
https://www.maxpreps.com/news/kBJ0M...season-top-100-high-school-football-teams.htm
Naz #1 in IL - Max Preps
- Thread starter Magnum Opus
- Start date
In a nutshell and especially from a last few years standpoint...yes sorta.
I don't think that ranking Naz #1 is an indication IL is bad. The rankings from outside and inside have been interesting to say the least. Those inside the state have made the national media preoccupied with Phillips. Then when they go get demolished on ESPN it makes the state look weak.
I think you still have to go with Loyola at this point.
I think you still have to go with Loyola at this point.
Loyola would have pounded the piss out of Naz last year.
No chance, Naz wins this head to head contest in a close game.
I don’t think it’s a talent thing as much as it’s numbers game. Look at all the schools from CA, TX and FL. All with populations 2-3 times bigger than Illinois. We never seem to have more than 1 or 2 schools ranked each year.
Doing a quick count, in addition to the 3 states you mention, there are an additional 15 other states plus DC ahead of the first Illinois team. More to it than your 3 big states argument.
Naz being #1 in Illinois wasn’t his argument for Illinois being weak. His point is that if the best team in Illinois is only #67 on the list that that’s not very good.
I would like to know how many starters in the SEC conference are from Illinois?
I think the answer would tell us everything about how much talent is in Illinois.
I think the answer would tell us everything about how much talent is in Illinois.
I get your point but I don’t think that would be an accurate measure for 2 reasons. 1- like almost every college most of their players are going to be recruited from their region. 2- it doesn’t account for a kid they offer and who may be a starter there if he chose them but for whatever reason he chose a big 10 school (or other non SEC school) instead. Look at any top guy who picks Michigan, Ohio state, Michigan state, etc. there is a good chance they had an SEC offer as well.
Love is a good example. He could have easily played in SEC but he went to ND.
I don't think we could name too many and that's my point. Jarvis would be another one.
I would be shocked if 5 starters from the SEC are from Illinois.
How about how many All Americans by state?
And it's always going to be skewed when some of those states are playing year round. I still remember going to summer camps and those teams were talking about their "spring season".
And it's always going to be skewed when some of those states are playing year round. I still remember going to summer camps and those teams were talking about their "spring season".
Do you mean in HS or college ball?
Because I think the numbers will not be very representatve if your looking at HS ball.
A big piece of it is the numbers game.
Go to the suburbs of Southern California or the Bay Area and you will find entire districts where 90% of the teams would compare favorably to our top ~5 teams.
Go to the suburbs of Southern California or the Bay Area and you will find entire districts where 90% of the teams would compare favorably to our top ~5 teams.
Don’t confuse the state with the city. It’s a basketball city. Indiana is a “basketball state.”
It's better known as a state filled with corruption.
I wouldn’t use such a subjective measure. HS All American rankings are subjective and skewed based on bias and perception of where the kid is from thus the current conversation. If you must use a measuring stick I guess I’d go with players on NFL rosters weighted by state population. Example: 20 NFL players from Louisiana would be better than 25 NFL players from California.
That's fine. But doesn't negate the crux of my argument which is that they flat out don't know what they're talking about.
They also have a team from Honolulu #11. If you believe that......one thing that is going to hurt IL in these is that a school doesn't generally dominate the state year after year. National polls like to see that. The closest thing we have is Loyola. They also prefer to look at college offers, we here in IL know that offers =/= championships, at least not in the top classes. They also want to see out of state games to see how states compare to each other. We don't really do that here consistently enough for better consideration.
I love the national discussions and speculation, but I don't think those rankings are an indication of anything except an underinformed opinion, and that's of mostly all states not just IL.
Here ya go: (this was from a 2018 Bruce Feldman tweet so don’t know the exact date in relation to number of active NFL players)
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Here ya go: (this was from a 2018 Bruce Feldman tweet so don’t know the exact year of the date in relation to number of active NFL players)
Also if you look at this article and scroll to bottom chart where it has this heading “
Blue Chip Recruits vs. Active NFL Players, Relative to US Population-Weighted Average” and look at the far right number on the chart it ranks NFL players by state population (Illinois comes in at number 31):
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.fo...ollege-football-recruiting-prospects-by-state
And while East St Louis fans won't want to hear this....until they can beat a Mt. Carmel like team in Chicago deep in the season...I can see ranking them only so high. And I know all the talent they have back etc. but in my twisted mind that's the reality for the Flyers these days. And sadly seeing East Side in 7A is probably over...
Preseason rankings? I think my bird cage needs a new liner
Amen.
I for one have grown really tired of hearing this.
Pick a Friday night and go to a High School gym and look at the crowd and then compare it to the stands of a Friday night football game.
Football Playoff games draw more.
Football State Final games draw more.
We all know all the privates should be in the same Class with no Public Teams. If you did this Naz would lose more than 1 game for sure. My point is they are not best team in Illinois.
Talent is very subjective and word of mouth Illinois has a lot more talent that just is not getting an opportunity to show their stuff. But I do agree California and Florida and Texas have more talent.
Talent is very subjective and word of mouth Illinois has a lot more talent that just is not getting an opportunity to show their stuff. But I do agree California and Florida and Texas have more talent.
That made my head hurt... what are you arguing? If Naz played exclusively private’s they’d lose more? And that’s why public and private should be separate? You understand that they play exclusively private’s in the regular season (except the ocassional non-conference game) right? And they have to play both the best private’s and Public’s in their class in the playoffs right? What am I missing? You make is sound like they are getting the advantage of playing Public’s in the playoffs even though they are playing big public powers with 2,000 students like Batavia due to the success factor and whichever good private’s they may encounter in the playoffs. Last year had Mount Carmel beat St Charles North it would have been MC vs Naz.... do you think that would have changed the outcome for Naz? I’m not sure what you are saying.
Additionally, if you separated the public and private’s you would then really have an argument about who’s the best in the state. At least this way you don’t have to argue is the public champ better than the private champ etc. If they were separate last year and LWE won the public and Loyola won the private who honestly after Loyola’s poor regular season would have argued that Loyola was better... certainly no one on the public side. But look what happened when they played, Loyola won. Just one example in one class in one season. This would happen all the time if they were separated.
But you are a “New Member” so maybe you are here to try and take this thread down the public / private separation route and into the dumpster!
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Total # playing in the SEC from Illinois is 11-12 with Mizzou having the most. Those that start
TE from SHG at Mizzou ,
Kicker from Mizzou is from O’ Fallon I believe
O lineman from So.IL. starts at ole miss ,
O lineman from Richmond should start this yr at Arkansas
Vandy kicker is from Naperville
The only question, IMO, about Naz this year is their O-line. If they get that in order, they will win 7A again. They have the best QB in the state. Maybe the best the state has produced in over a decade. They are loaded with skill position talent and have a lot back on defense. They have the most next level talent of anyone in IL with the possible exception of ESL. Again, the only question is the O-line.
Nice job, I'm shocked!
With all those kickers from Illinois, you think they could lend one to the Bears?
Sean Price?
Tim Brasic?
Joe Ganz?
Jake Christensen?
The kid from Rochester?
I'm just throwing some names out for the discussion...
Darrell Jenkins
Good passers but nay...Sean Price?
Tim Brasic?
Joe Ganz?
Jake Christensen?
The kid from Rochester?
I'm just throwing some names out for the discussion...
Darrell Jenkins
Mike Tomczak - Although I did not like him
Eric Kumerow
Donovan McNabb
Chuck Long
Otto Graham, Waukegan, 1938; Sean Price, Maine South, 2003;; Dusty Burk, Tuscola, 1997; Chuck Hartlieb, Marian Central, 1983;, 1980; Jon Beutjer, Wheaton Warrenville South, 1998; Kent Graham, Wheaton North, 1986; Kurt Kittner, Schaumburg, 1997; Zeke Bratkowski, Danville Schlarman, 1948; Tommy O'Connell, South Shore, 1947; Hiles Stout, Peoria Central, 1952; Ken Anderson, Batavia, 1966; Mark Carlson, Deerfield, 1975; Jim Finks, Salem, 1944; Juice Williams, Vocational, 2006; Antwaan Randle El, Thornton, 1996; Tim Brasic, Riverside-Brookfield, 2001; Jeff Hecklinski, Palatine, 1992.
Eric Kumerow
Donovan McNabb
Chuck Long
Otto Graham, Waukegan, 1938; Sean Price, Maine South, 2003;; Dusty Burk, Tuscola, 1997; Chuck Hartlieb, Marian Central, 1983;, 1980; Jon Beutjer, Wheaton Warrenville South, 1998; Kent Graham, Wheaton North, 1986; Kurt Kittner, Schaumburg, 1997; Zeke Bratkowski, Danville Schlarman, 1948; Tommy O'Connell, South Shore, 1947; Hiles Stout, Peoria Central, 1952; Ken Anderson, Batavia, 1966; Mark Carlson, Deerfield, 1975; Jim Finks, Salem, 1944; Juice Williams, Vocational, 2006; Antwaan Randle El, Thornton, 1996; Tim Brasic, Riverside-Brookfield, 2001; Jeff Hecklinski, Palatine, 1992.
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